Circular motion : direction of frictional force

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the direction of the frictional force acting on a particle in circular motion on a table. Participants explore the relationship between centripetal force and static friction, questioning how these forces interact in the context of circular motion, and whether friction acts towards the center or tangentially to the motion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the centripetal force must equal the static friction force and suggests that friction should point opposite to the center of the circular path.
  • Another participant asks how the particle is constrained to move in a circle and notes that kinetic friction acts opposite to motion, while static friction does not, as there is no motion.
  • A participant proposes that if the object is undergoing uniform circular motion, friction must act towards the center of the circle to provide the necessary centripetal force.
  • There is a suggestion that friction prevents slipping and allows the object to maintain circular motion, otherwise it would slide outward.
  • Some participants express confusion about the nature of the particle and the role of friction, with one noting that a particle, being a point, cannot experience static friction if it is in motion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the direction of the frictional force in circular motion, with some asserting it acts towards the center while others suggest it may be tangential. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives on the role of friction.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in understanding the definitions of static and kinetic friction as they apply to the scenario, and the assumptions regarding the nature of the particle and the forces acting on it are not fully clarified.

fluidistic
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Hi PF,
I have a question. Say a particle describes a circular motion over a table. We have that the modulus of the centripetal force must equal the one of the static friction force, right? And according to Newton's second law the frictional force must be parallel to the radius pointing at the particle, but in the opposite direction. However I thought that the frictional force always point in the opposite direction of motion.
In the case of a circular motion the centripetal acceleration always point through the center of the path while the motion is circular.
Hence my question is : in what direction does point the frictional force in the case of a circular motion? (My guess is that it points in the opposite direction of the center of the path, while my intuition would say it's tangent to the circular path).
Thank you.
 
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How is the particle being constrained to move in a circle?

Edit: Another point to make is that kinetic friction always acts in the opposite direction to motion, but this is not the case for static friction (since there is no motion!).
 
Last edited:
fluidistic said:
Hence my question is : in what direction does point the frictional force in the case of a circular motion?
I assume you are thinking of an object like a car that can roll, not a particle. Is friction the only force acting on the object? Is the object undergoing uniform circular motion? (Constant speed.) If so, then friction must provide the centripetal force and must act towards the center of the circle.

Friction acts to prevent slipping between surfaces. Without friction to keep it going in a circle, the object would slide outwards. Friction prevents that.
 
Hootenanny said:
How is the particle being contained to move in a circle?
I don't understand well the question. The particle moves in a circular motion because of the frictional force between the table and the particle itself. This force is responsible for the centripetal force, hence the circular motion of the particle. Or am I wrong?
 
Doc Al said:
I assume you are thinking of an object like a car that can roll, not a particle. Is friction the only force acting on the object? Is the object undergoing uniform circular motion? (Constant speed.) If so, then friction must provide the centripetal force and must act towards the center of the circle.

Friction acts to prevent slipping between surfaces. Without friction to keep it going in a circle, the object would slide outwards. Friction prevents that.
Ah ok, I get it. The answer was conform to my guess and Newton's second law, but in counter of my intuition. Thanks.
EDIT :
Edit: Another point to make is that kinetic friction always acts in the opposite direction to motion, but this is not the case for static friction (since there is no motion!).
, wow, that was well said. Now I fully understand. Thank you.
 
fluidistic said:
I don't understand well the question. The particle moves in a circular motion because of the frictional force between the table and the particle itself. This force is responsible for the centripetal force, hence the circular motion of the particle. Or am I wrong?
As Doc Al mentioned, I was a little confused by your question since a particle is simply a point and therefore there cannot be any static friction if the particle is moving.
 

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