Another implicit function problem

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the implicit function theorem and its application to a specific problem involving the existence of a C² function \( y(x) \) that satisfies the equation \( y(x)^3 + 3y(x) = x \) near \( x = 0 \). Participants are exploring how to differentiate the equation and the implications of their findings on the derivatives at that point.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss differentiating the given equation and the implications of their results on the derivatives. There is mention of using the implicit function theorem and calculating partial derivatives, with some confusion about the correct form of the derivative. Questions arise regarding the Jacobian and Hessian matrices and their roles in determining the conditions for the function to be C².

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of the correct differentiation process and the conditions required for the implicit function theorem. Some participants are clarifying their understanding of the Jacobian and Hessian matrices, while others are questioning how to verify that the function is indeed C².

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of the implicit function theorem and its requirements, including the need to check the determinants of the Jacobian and Hessian matrices. There is an acknowledgment of the need for careful differentiation and the implications of the results on the existence of the function.

Srumix
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I'm having some trouble grasping the implicit function theroem in some cases. Here's one of them.

Homework Statement



Show that there exist a C2 function y(x) in some neighbourhood of 0 such that y(0) = 0 and

y(x)3 + 3y(x) = x

Find y'(0) and y''(0)

Homework Equations



The implicit function theorem: If there exist a implicit y(x) for function if D2f(a,b) does not equal zero at the point (0,0)

The Attempt at a Solution



I tried differentiating the given function but i then get 3y(x)2*y'(x) + 3*y'(x) = 0.

But given the condition y(0) = 0 this must imply that y'(0) = 0 which is a contradiction?

The problem is given in a way such that there should be such a function, but I'm obviously doing something wrong here.
 
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There are two ways that you can go about this, there is the easy way which as you say, use the implicit function theorem (you have to use partial derivatives, you need to calculate the whole matrix of derivatives btw.) and for that you need to calculate partial derivatives, not the total one, the derivative you got wrong, it should be 3y^{2}(x)y'(x)+3y'(x)=1, if you're differentiating w.r.t x.

The other way is to solve the equation for y(x) by using the standard solution for a cubic and verify that the function is indeed C^2 in the neighbourhood of 0.
 
Oh yes. Kind of stupid of me to mess upp the derivative.

When you say the matrix of derivatives, do you mean the "jacobian"? Should I calculate the Jacobian first for the first partial derivative and then the jacobian for the second derivative to check that the determinant of the jacobian isn't zero?

Thanks!
 
Check out the conditions for the implicit function theorem. You will need to check out the Jacobian.
 
hunt_mat said:
Check out the conditions for the implicit function theorem. You will need to check out the Jacobian.

Yeah I think I understood that. However I'm having trouble of how I should do to check that it is actually C2. To check that it is C2, should I insert D2f(x,y) in the second row of the jacobian and keep the first row the same as I did when checking for C1?
 
Check out the Hessian matrix then.
 
hunt_mat said:
Check out the Hessian matrix then.

I have not much experience with the Hessian. Is it required (in analogue to the Jacobian) that it's determinant isn't equal to zero for the implicit function to be defined as C2? Or is there any other general method to determine wether there exist a C2 function.

Thanks for your help!
 
Last edited:

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