Block on incline with air resistance, no friction

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on calculating the time it takes for a textbook of mass 1.24 kg to slide down a frictionless incline at a 30° angle, while experiencing air resistance proportional to the square of its speed, described by the equation F = kmv² with k = 0.86 m⁻¹. Participants highlight the importance of correctly setting up the differential equations, particularly noting the need to account for the drag force and the gravitational components. The correct approach involves transforming the differential equation into a function of distance and integrating it, leading to a time calculation that yields realistic values when properly executed.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Newton's second law (F = ma)
  • Familiarity with differential equations and integration techniques
  • Knowledge of hyperbolic functions and their properties
  • Basic principles of kinematics in inclined planes
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the application of hyperbolic trigonometric substitutions in integrals
  • Learn about drag forces in physics, specifically quadratic drag
  • Explore numerical methods for solving differential equations
  • Investigate the effects of varying mass and drag coefficients on motion down an incline
USEFUL FOR

Students in physics, particularly those studying mechanics and dynamics, as well as educators looking for examples of real-world applications of differential equations in motion analysis.

inferno298
Messages
25
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



A textbook of mass m = 1.24 kg starts at rest on a
frictionless inclined plane (angle  = 30◦). Although there is
no friction, suppose there is a drag force (due to air resistance)
acting on the book which is proportional to the speed squared
and is described by the equation F = kmv2, where k = 0.86
m−1. How much time does it take for the textbook to slide a
distance d = 1.65 m down the plane? (Hint: This one is tricky,
you will need to solve the integral by hand using a hyperbolic
trig substitution.)

Homework Equations



Just F=m*a
drag force = k*m*v^2

The Attempt at a Solution



So the mass keeps canceling on me whenever I run the problem, don't know if I actually need it for this one. I changed my coordinate system so positive x was parallel to the incline and positive y was perpendicular to it.

Forces are gravity broken in componets now, normal force only acting in positive y, canceled out by gravities y component. drag force in -x direction and +x component of gravity.
Vf= final velocity
y- direction F=ma
F= 0, its moving down the incline

x - direction F= ma
m*g*cos(theata)-k*m*v^2 = m dv/dt
solve it for time with given conditions and I got
T = (1/(Sqrt[g*sin(theata)*k])*ArcTanh[Sqrt[k/(g*sin(theata))]*Vf]

Switch the beginning equation to m*g*cos(theata)-k*m*v^2 = m*v* dv/dx and solve for the distance given the distance yields:
x = (1/2*k)*Ln((g*sin(theata)-k*Vf^2)/(g*sin(theata)))
Solve that equation for Vf yields:
Vf = Sqrt[(g*sin(theata)/k)*(1-e^(2*k*x))/k)
Sub into T equation and get:
T = (1/(Sqrt[g*sin(theata)*k])*ArcTanh(1-e^(2*k*x))

I keep getting very small times less than one and complex numbers which I feel are wrong, well its telling me they are wrong. I might have set it up wrong when defining my coordinate system or something. if someone can help me that would be awesome, even if its on a regular defined coordinate axes.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
It's an old post so I'm not sure if you still want advice, but I think the issue comes with your second diff eq you set up to solve for the distance.

You can save a lot of work and simply turn your first diff eq into a function of distance right off the bat by using derivatives of ##x(t)## in place of ##v## and ##a##. This can be integrated without trouble given 2 initial conditions on velocity and position. From there, you should have a function ##x(t)## that you can use to plug in your numbers and numerically invert. It seemed to give a reasonable real value for time when I worked it out.
 
inferno298 said:
Switch the beginning equation to m*g*cos(theata)-k*m*v^2 = m*v* dv/dx and solve for the distance given the distance yields:
x = (1/2*k)*Ln((g*sin(theata)-k*Vf^2)/(g*sin(theata)))

You miss a negative sign in front of the right-hand side.

The data might be wrong. The speed can not exceed √(gsinθ/k), but the value obtained with the given d and k does.
ehild
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
6K
Replies
16
Views
2K
Replies
6
Views
1K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
Replies
7
Views
1K
  • · Replies 33 ·
2
Replies
33
Views
2K