Calculate Horsepower to Velocity for Model Train Control

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    Horsepower Velocity
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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on calculating the relationship between horsepower (HP) and velocity for a model train control system. Participants explore how to apply real-world physics to control model trains, considering various factors such as acceleration, power settings, and resistance forces.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks to relate horsepower to velocity or acceleration for model trains, referencing specific train specifications.
  • Another participant argues that horsepower does not directly correlate with velocity, providing examples to illustrate this point.
  • A request for information on what is needed to calculate the velocity of the train is made, indicating a need for further clarification.
  • A participant points out that the given values include a stated speed of 65 mph, questioning its relevance to the original inquiry.
  • One participant describes a momentum control system for a locomotive with multiple power settings, emphasizing the effect of load on acceleration.
  • Another participant suggests considering rolling resistance and aerodynamic drag in calculations, providing a formula for acceleration and discussing the complexity of varying gradients.
  • A participant expresses gratitude for the initial guidance and indicates a willingness to continue developing the calculations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the relationship between horsepower and velocity, with multiple viewpoints presented regarding the factors that influence train acceleration and speed. The discussion remains unresolved with various models and considerations proposed.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the need to account for rolling resistance, aerodynamic drag, and gradient forces, indicating that these factors complicate the calculations. There is also an acknowledgment of the simplifications made to start the discussion.

KaiGrid
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Hello, I'm building a model train control system, and would like to use real world values and physics to control the trains. I have these specifications about each model of train, and would like to know how I could relate given HP to velocity or Δacceleration.
Given Values are located here: http://www.thedieselshop.us/Data%20EMD%20GP40.HTML
 
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KaiGrid said:
Hello, I'm building a model train control system, and would like to use real world values and physics to control the trains. I have these specifications about each model of train, and would like to know how I could relate given HP to velocity or Δacceleration.
Given Values are located here: http://www.thedieselshop.us/Data%20EMD%20GP40.HTML

HP does not relate directly to velocity. You could put a 1 HP motor on a real train and it would go at approximately zero mph, or you could put one on a roller skate and it would go maybe 50 mph.
 
Information

What information would I need to calculate the velocity of this train?
 
In the link to the "Given values" is says the speed is 65 mph, is that not what you want?

Cheers,
Terry
 
I'm trying to make a momentum control. In a locomotive, there are 9 engine settings (0-8). Each setting is a different percentage of applied power. Under different loads (mass), the train will accelerate faster or slower. I want a way to calculate how much power is being applied to the train (real life), so that I can apply it to the scale model.
 
OK. If you ignore rail gradient (a simplification to get started on this) the first thing to account for is rolling resistance. See here <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_resistance> for a coefficient. That will give a (more or less) constant force the engine must provide to maintain any speed. To accelerate you can use F=m.a, i.e for your mass and tractive force/effort you can calculate an acceleration. You will have to guess your tractive effort as a function of engine setting, maybe a simple ratio i.e 8=100%, 4=50% ??
The other thing that affects all this is aero drag which is a drag force usually proportional to speed squared, and will really only play a part at higher speeds, but is you want to include it you will need to find a suitable drag coefficient for your train.
The gradient force is the component of the weight (W.cos.theta) where theta is the angle to the horizontal.
It all gets a bit complicated when you have some of the train on the level, some on the up grade, some on down grade etc!

Cheers,
Terry
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thank you so much for the starting point! I will continue to work on it!
 

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