Calculating STEVE's Height from Two Photos 370km Apart

[astroscout]

A friend of mine was able to photograph STEVE and later found out that another photographer also captured the same event. One captured it from the south and the other from the north. He has asked me if using the the information from both locations, can the height of STEVE be calculated? The two photographers were about 370 km apart. Here is a drawing he sent me via Facebook.

 

[DaveC426913]

Link busted.
You can't link directly to Facebook.

Download the image to your drive, (right-click: 'open image in new tab', go to tab, right click: 'save image as...')
then upload it here as a file.Yes. You could calculate its height if you can get an accurate idea of the angle above the horizon from both pictures. That'll be easier said than done.

The next question is: will you get a more accurate altitude than that understood to be STEVE's normal.

According to Wiki, that's about 280mi.

 

[astroscout]

I tried but all I get with the image button is to paste a link. I see no option for selecting a file from my PC. Am I missing something?

 

[DaveC426913]

I tried but all I get with the image button is to paste a link. I see no option for selecting a file from my PC. Am I missing something?

Not on the toolbar. Bottom of message window: [UPLOAD], next to [POST REPLY].

 

[astroscout]

Got it . Thanx.

 

[DaveC426913]

Yes. As described. That's how you'd calculate it.

Those "known angles" oughtta be tricky tho.

(I thought you were going to upload the actual pics... )

 

[astroscout]

I just contacted my friend and he will send them and I will post them here. The other photographer has not responded to his message yet so it could be a while Here is a link to his youtube video of STEVE.

 

[berkeman]

What's a STEVE?

I just contacted my friend

Oh, your buddy. Got it.

(It's a good idea to define your acronyms, unless everbody in the target forum should know what it means.)

 

[astroscout]

berkeman...STEVE is a purplish colored skyglow event that is seen usually while auroras are present but they are unrelated. There is still a lot of research to be done though.

 

[berkeman]

berkeman...STEVE is a purplish colored skyglow event that is seen usually while auroras are present but they are unrelated. There is still a lot of research to be done though.

Interesting. What does the acronym STEVE stand for?

 

[astroscout]

STEVE = Strong Thermal Emission Velocity Enhancement

 

[DaveC426913]

There's something even berkeman doesn't know?
:cries with relief:

(intended to evoke a berkemanian smirk)

 

[astroscout]

Here is a screen capture of STEVE taken from the video at youtube.I enhanced it a bit to show the purplish color. This was taken by Paul Smith in Grassland, Alberta in Canada. He will use Stellarium to figure out the angle from his location.

 

[davenn]

Here is a screen capture of STEVE taken from the video at youtube.I enhanced it a bit to show the purplish color. This was taken by Paul Smith in Grassland, Alberta in Canada. He will use Stellarium to figure out the angle from his location.

ummm... that's the picket fence style aurora
STEVE is usually a single band, like a streamer across the sky

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_(atmospheric_phenomenon)

 

[astroscout]

I could be wrong about what I enhanced as being STEVE. I'll check with the photographer and will get back to you guys on this.

 

[astroscout]

I just checked with the photographer and the purple colored picket fence is indeed STEVE. I guess from some locations it will be seen as a single band and in others as an arc. I'm no expert so I will have to accept any other suggestions as to whether this is a STEVE event or not. I am going by the purple color and maybe the photographer is also.

 

[astroscout]

Here is another picture of the event from the same photographer. He says that the photos seen on the web are when STEVE is beneath. The one he captured was way north of STEVE. He also stated that his coordinates were 54.937806 -112.510886 and the other photographers was approx 49.709387 -112.866389.

 

[astroscout]

I just sent the photographer a link to this thread and I have advised him to sign up as a member of this forum and to answer any other questions you might have.

 

[davenn]

I just checked with the photographer and the purple colored picket fence is indeed STEVE. I guess from some locations it will be seen as a single band and in others as an arc. I'm no expert so I will have to accept any other suggestions as to whether this is a STEVE event or not. I am going by the purple color and maybe the photographer is also.

I have been observing aurora for 50 years ... I would be really surprised if it is a STEVE ... I have seen and photo'ed a number
of them over the years back in New Zealand, long before digital cams

Here's a scanned 1980's photo of mine from Dunedin, New Zealand
this arc went almost from horizon to horizon right overhead

Up to a few years ago, we all ( worldwide) were calling these things proton arcs ... It's only a couple of years ago that
the name change to STEVE was made when the truer nature of the arcs were better understood

I am 99.99% certain that SETVE's do not produce green picket fence type of displays ... that is just one form of normal aurora
And you need to be aware that purple in an aurora is very common

another couple from my NZ collection

Dave

 

[Paul m Smith]

Hello all. I am the original photographer of the Steve event and have lots of experience photographing aurora. I'm part of an online community called Alberta aurora chasers. The admin of this group is Chris Ratzlaff , he originally named the airglow band Steve and is very active in the citizen science community.This is indeed a Steve event that was observed for almost one hour by multiple people early morning April 10th 2018 over Alberta Canada. Sar arcs are a separate phenomena altogether. Steve events ( the purple/white ribbon) can sometimes be accompanied by the green picket fence lines which may originate from the same process as typical aurora vs Steve which is thought to be ionic drift. If there are any further questions about steve or this capture I would be more than happy to help any way I can. I thought it would be ground breaking and really interesting if the height / thickness of the band, and the size of the pickets could be determined from observations from multiple viewpoints. Thanks for any help

 

[Paul m Smith]

I should add . The green picket fence features are magnetically aligned substructures, thought to be produced by particle precipitation ( like typical aurora) . But they are exclusively observed accompanying Steve events

 

[davenn]

But they are exclusively observed accompanying Steve events

That I have to very strongly disagree with !

They are seen very regularly as part of typical auroral displays when there is absolutely no sign of a STEVE event

 

[Paul m Smith]

I'm sorry, but I am very well versed in aurora and vertical picket fence aurora is ONLY captured with STEVE events. There is literally no documented evidence of the contrary whereas there are hundreds of captures of picket fence aurora with STEVE. I have come here for help with a question and not to get uneducated responses. Please , I only ask for help with the question, I am not here to argue against invalid responses

 

[Paul m Smith]

I am working with another photographer to get an image with GPS coordinates and timestamp. I will be able to post a diagram to better illustrate the question. As a side note , these images and the video I captured have been requested and commented on by Elizabeth MacDonald who is a program scientist specializing in aurora and STEVE at NASA Goddard. It is a STEVE, without a doubt and indeed picket fence aurora ONLY occur during STEVE events. I have photographed aurora over hundreds of evenings and the picket fence is only there when STEVE is

 

[Drakkith]

It is a STEVE, without a doubt and indeed picket fence aurora ONLY occur during STEVE events. I have photographed aurora over hundreds of evenings and the picket fence is only there when STEVE is

Are these STEVEs always easily visible alongside the picket fence, or is there sometimes a reason the STEVE isn't visible? I only ask because I found several photos on google images that appear to show a picket fence aurora but no STEVE. Here's an example:

Perhaps the STEVE is the glow to the upper right of the aurora?

 

[davenn]

I'm sorry, but I am very well versed in aurora

likewise ... since 1960 and you ??

I have seen dozens of aurora with picket fence displays and many photos from other people with no STEVE present

 

[Paul m Smith]

Are these STEVEs always easily visible alongside the picket fence, or is there sometimes a reason the STEVE isn't visible? I only ask because I found several photos on google images that appear to show a picket fence aurora but no STEVE. Here's an example:

View attachment 236055

Perhaps the STEVE is the glow to the upper right of the aurora?

Thank you for proving my point. STEVE is right there in that picture above the pickets

 

[Paul m Smith]

likewise ... since 1960 and you ??

I have seen dozens of aurora with picket fence displays and many photos from other people with no STEVE present

You are not looking hard enough. STEVE will always be there , whether faint or out of frame

 

[Paul m Smith]

likewise ... since 1960 and you ??

I have seen dozens of aurora with picket fence displays and many photos from other people with no STEVE present

I just told you the facts coming from the mouth of NASA scientists and you a disagreeing? Please only comment if you are contributing to the question. I will respectfully ignore all other posts otherwise. I strongly urge you to research before you comment, the information is out there if you wish to be educated

 

[Drakkith]

I just told you the facts coming from the mouth of NASA scientists and you a disagreeing? Please only comment if you are contributing to the question. I will respectfully ignore all other posts otherwise.

Don't take offense from Davenn. We have no way of immediately knowing whether your claim is true, and personal experience is hard to trump without access to a reliable and verifiable source of information on the topic.