Calculating Tension in Friction & Pulley: Solving for a=3 m/s^2

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the tension in a string connected to a block on a flat car that is accelerating. The problem involves concepts from dynamics, specifically Newton's laws, friction, and the relationship between the acceleration of the block and the car.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the forces acting on the block, including tension and friction, and question how these forces relate to the block's acceleration. There are discussions about the direction of forces and the implications of the car's acceleration on the block's motion.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, raising questions about the relationships between forces and the motion of the block. Some have offered insights into the forces at play, while others are seeking clarification on specific aspects of the problem.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted lack of information regarding the mass of the flat car, which some participants express as a concern. Additionally, there are discussions about the assumptions made regarding the massless pulley and the nature of friction in this context.

  • #31
gracy said:
When we board in bus ,we are initially (before getting in bus)at rest,but then start traveling at the speed of bus,As per Newton's first law some external must acts on us.What's that?Is it fiction ?
You may find this trivial,but seriously that's why I was thinking that flat car does exert force on block.
No, it's not fiction, it's friction. The bus is stationary when you board. You are standung, say. When the bus starts, if there were ni friction between your shoes and the bus floor you would remain still, your shoes sliding, until you hit the back of the bus.
 
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  • #32
gracy said:
Is it fiction ?
typo.
 
  • #33
Is my calculation in post #37 correct?
 
  • #34
gracy said:
Is my calculation in post #37 correct?
If you mean #27, yes. So,
- which way does that friction force act?
- are there any other horizontal forces on the block other than friction and the string tension?
- what is the sum of horizontal forces on the block?
- what is the acceleration of the block?
 
  • #35
haruspex said:
If you mean #27,
Yes.
 
  • #36
As tension force never pushes it always pulls .So block should move forward.
 
Last edited:
  • #37
Is there any tension force in the end which is tied to wall (I have pointed out that end in my below diagram)

truck.png

I think there should be.
 
  • #38
gracy said:
As tension force never pushes it always pulls block should move forward.
In particular, forward relative to the car. So friction acts the other way, agreed? What, then, is the sum of forces?
 
  • #39
gracy said:
Is there any tension force in the end which is tied to wall (I have pointed out that end in my below diagram)

View attachment 81877
I think there should be.
Yes. What is the relationship between the tension there and the tension at the end attached to the block?
 
  • #40
They should be same.As string and pulley is massless(assumption)
 
  • #41
Wait,I think I am getting the solution now.
 
  • #42
gracy said:
They should be same.As string and pulley is massless(assumption)
Right.
 
  • #43
I wish Mass of flat car was given!
 
  • #44
gracy said:
I wish Mass of flat car was given!
As I posted previously, you don't care about the mass of the car or the forces on it because you know exactly how it is moving. Concentrate on the forces on the block and its acceleration.
 
  • #45
Is it correct.
tr.png
 
  • #46
gracy said:
Is it correct.
View attachment 81878
Whether or not it is correct, it is irrelevant. Please just answer my questions in post ##34.
 
  • #47
haruspex said:
- which way does that friction force act
Backward.
haruspex said:
- are there any other horizontal forces on the block other than friction and the string tension?
No.
haruspex said:
what is the sum of horizontal forces on the block?
T-150N =30Kg multiplied by acceleration of the block.
haruspex said:
what is the acceleration of the block?
Here I am struggling.
 
  • #48
gracy said:
Backward.

No.

T-150N =30Kg multiplied by acceleration of the block.

Here I am struggling.
Ok so far.
The string is of constant length. If the car moves 1m, the top part of the string gets how much longer? What does that tell you about the length of the lower part? How far has the block moved?
 
  • #49
Sorry,actually I am really pedantic.
haruspex said:
the top part of the string

Did you mean the part of string indicated?
 

Attachments

  • truck.png
    truck.png
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  • #50
gracy said:
Sorry,actually I am really pedantic.Did you mean the part of string indicated?
Yes.
 
  • #51
I think the top part of the string should be
567.png
 
  • #52
gracy said:
I think the top part of the string should beView attachment 81886
That cannot be string, or the pulley would fall down. Must be a rod.
The upper part of the string runs drom the wall to the pulley. How much longer does that get when the car advances 1m?
 
  • #53
haruspex said:
How much longer does that get when the car advances 1m?
Same as distance covered by small block.
 
  • #54
gracy said:
Same as distance covered by small block.
No. Forget the block for the moment, and concentrate on the car, the pulley, the wall, and the length of string from wall to pulley. If the car moves 1m further from the pulley, how much longer is that part of the string?
 
  • #55
haruspex said:
How much longer does that get when the car advances 1m?
Total length of string - length of the top part of the string ?
 
  • #56
gracy said:
Total length of string - length of the top part of the string ?
No, I'm asking about that top part of the string, the part that runs horizontally from the wall to the pulley.
 
  • #57
gracy said:
Total length of string -(minus) length of the top part of the string .Right?/QUOTE]
2 PICTURES.png
 
  • #58
Thank you for your patience .
 
  • #59
If the car moves 1m further from the wall, how much further is the pulley from the wall? So how much longer is the piece of string from the wall to the pulley?
 
  • #60
1 meter?
 

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