Can I take analysis only? without calculus?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the prerequisites for taking an analysis course (MAT157Y1) at a university, specifically whether it is necessary to complete a calculus course beforehand. Participants explore the nature of the course, its content, and the implications of the exclusion policy mentioned in the course description.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions if calculus is necessary to take analysis, citing the course description which emphasizes theoretical aspects of calculus.
  • Another participant asserts that calculus is foundational for upper-level mathematics, suggesting it is essential.
  • A student familiar with the university states that MAT157Y1 can be taken without prior calculus courses, indicating it serves as an introduction to analysis rather than a true analysis course.
  • Concerns are raised about the exclusion policy, with participants explaining that it prevents students from taking certain courses for credit after completing others.
  • One participant expresses worry about the textbook used (Spivak) not covering vectors, questioning if prior knowledge is assumed.
  • Another participant clarifies that MAT157Y1 is still fundamentally a calculus course and that it covers essential topics from calculus without assuming prior knowledge.
  • Discussion includes whether it is common for students to skip calculus and take analysis first, with mixed responses regarding the redundancy of taking multiple calculus courses simultaneously.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity of calculus before taking analysis. While some argue that calculus is essential, others suggest that the analysis course can be taken independently. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the commonality of skipping calculus for analysis.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the course MAT157Y1 is described as a rigorous version of calculus, which may lead to confusion about its classification as an analysis course. The exclusion policy and its implications for course selection are also discussed but not fully clarified.

hamsterpower7
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Hi, I am studying calculus right now (by myself)
When I go to university, is it necessary to take the calculus course to take analysis?

the course description said:


MAT157Y1 Analysis I[72L/48T]
A theoretical course in calculus; emphasizing proofs and techniques, as well as geometric and physical understanding. Trigonometric identities. Limits and continuity; least upper bounds, intermediate and extreme value theorems. Derivatives, mean value and inverse function theorems. Integrals; fundamental theorem; elementary transcendental functions. Taylors theorem; sequences and series; uniform convergence and power series.

Prerequisite: MCV4U, MHF4U
Exclusion: MAT137Y1
Distribution Requirement Status: This is a Science course
Breadth Requirement: The Physical and Mathematical Universes (5)

does exclusion mean I can't take that course?
 
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What are pre-requisites MCV4U and MHF4U?

Also, I would say YES--you need calculus as a foundation for all upper-level mathematics IMO.
 
those are grade 12 courses in high school (canada)
 
Hello. I'm a student at this university ( I recognize the course description ) and you can take this course on your first year (without any prerequisite other calculus courses). In fact if you are hoping to become a math specialist you are required to take this course over other calculus courses.
This course isn't concerned with "true analysis", this is just a "taste of analysis". For example, you will not see metric spaces, topology.. et c. It is just a rigorous version of calculus; so it is still a "calculus" course.

The exclusion indicator means that you cannot take the exclusion course after you have completed the course you are looking at. For example, if you finish 157, you cannot take 137 ( at least not for a credit )
 
You are presumably going to college, yes?

That said, i think it is a fair deduction that you will be studying something technical (physics/math/engineering), is this right?

If so...calculus will be required for your degree in all likelyhood, so i don't see the problem.

Also, your actual question is about the "exclusion"; something unique to the institution offering this course. I have never heard of this, and it is likely that many others not going to this school share my lack of knowledge. I would contact the university...

edit: I just read the post above me ><
 
wisvuze said:
The exclusion indicator means that you cannot take the exclusion course after you have completed the course you are looking at. For example, if you finish 157, you cannot take 137 ( at least not for a credit )

aha thank you
Do many others just skip calculus and take analysis first?
is it common to take 135H1 and 136H1 (calculus that is not on the exclusion list) along analysis?

I was worried because the textbook they use in the course is spivak and I had a look at it
they don't seem to teach vectors, may be they are assuming you know them by high school
just wanted to make sure
 
hamsterpower7 said:
aha thank you
Do many others just skip calculus and take analysis first?
is it common to take 135H1 and 136H1 (calculus that is not on the exclusion list) along analysis?

I was worried because the textbook they use in the course is spivak and I had a look at it
they don't seem to teach vectors, may be they are assuming you know them by high school
just wanted to make sure

Like I said, MAT157 is not an analysis course (despite the name), it is still a "calculus course". Your first actual analysis course will be MAT357 ( Real Analysis I ) or maybe MAT257 depending on how it is taught that year. MAT157 is a calculus course, there is no reason to take MAT135 along with MAT157 as you would be redundantly taking two calculus courses at once.. The only difference is MAT157 is supposed to be the more difficult version of calculus. You will cover derivatives, integrals, limits, continuity, series, sequences from scratch ( no previous knowledge assumed ).
You will learn about vectors from scratch as well if you take a linear algebra course ( preferably MAT240, then MAT247 ). Everything you learn will be from the ground-up, so no knowledge is assumed from high school ( you will learn everything differently anyway).
 
Thank you so much :) much appreciated
good luck in your study
 

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