Can I use ionized gas to make an electric arc at low voltage?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the feasibility of using ionized gas to create an electric arc at low voltage and current. Participants explore the conditions necessary for arc formation, the nature of ionized gases, and the implications of voltage and current in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether an electric arc can form with low current, suggesting that current is essential for the arc to occur as it heats the ionized air.
  • Another participant argues that an arc can form if the voltage is sufficiently high, referencing devices like Van de Graff generators and Tesla coils that operate on low current and high voltage principles.
  • A later reply raises concerns about the specifics of using already ionized gas, questioning how it can be maintained in an ionized state and whether high peak power in devices like Tesla coils implies high current during the arc.
  • One participant expresses skepticism about the availability of pre-ionized gas, stating that it is physically impossible to purchase such a substance.
  • Another participant explains that high voltage across a sparkgap causes gas ionization, discussing the sequence of discharge and ionization while noting that ionization facilitates current flow.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conditions necessary for arc formation, particularly regarding the roles of current and voltage. There is no consensus on whether low current can lead to an arc or the feasibility of using pre-ionized gas.

Contextual Notes

Participants discuss the complexities of ionization and arc formation, highlighting the need for high voltage and the sequence of events leading to discharge. There are unresolved questions about maintaining ionization and the nature of current in relation to arc formation.

physics3456
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I am exploring what electricity can do and I have a question.
First, can I use ionized gas to make an electric arc at low current?
Second, If I can do this, what kind of ionized gas could I use (that is bottled), can I use?
 
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I don't believe an arc will form with low current. It is the current itself that is causing the arc by flowing through the ionized air and heating it up, causing it to glow brightly.
 
Drakkith said:
I don't believe an arc will form with low current. It is the current itself that is causing the arc by flowing through the ionized air and heating it up, causing it to glow brightly.

it will if the voltage is high enough :)

just think of a Van de Graff generator or Tesla coil. both work on the principles of very low current and very high voltage
or even the discharge of static electricity as you rub your feet across the carpet and discharge via your finger tip to the door knob

Dave
 
davenn said:
it will if the voltage is high enough :)

just think of a Van de Graff generator or Tesla coil. both work on the principles of very low current and very high voltage
or even the discharge of static electricity as you rub your feet across the carpet and discharge via your finger tip to the door knob

Dave

True, but does the same apply to already ionized gas? Of course this begs the question, how did you ionize the gas in the first place and keep it ionized? Also, aren't Tesla Coils and similar devices very high on the Peak Power, meaning that the current is actually very high during the arc?
 
rereading the OP's comments...

he seems to be under the impression you can buy pre-ionised gas
As far as I am aware this is physically impossible

physics3456
it is the high voltage potential across a sparkgap within a gas that causes ionisation of the gas. When the breakdown voltage is reached there is a discharge across the sparkgap (through the gas) that results in the ionisation of the gas.

From reading other posts over time on this forum, there seems to be a bit of discussion as to what happens first, the discharge or the ionisation.
The ionisation does provide an easier path for current to flow as with a lightning strike, say between cloud and ground. Tho you don't need ionisation for current to flow ... as in a vacuum tube. But you do need the presence of an ionised gas to see a spark

thats the way I understand it ;)

maybe one of our mentors will chime in

Dave
 

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