Can Long-Term Marriage Retain Its Spark?

[J77]

Isn't the bottom line: if one has to analyse marriage, one probably isn't cut out for marriage

(That thing about analysis goes with most questions posted in general )

 

[Astronuc]

Isn't the bottom line: if one has to analyse marriage, one probably isn't cut out for marriage

(That thing about analysis goes with most questions posted in general )

But then, this is PHYSICS FORUMS! What does one expect?

 

[J77]

Yeah -- that's why I stuck the old tongue out

Tho' some things really shouldn't be over-analysed

 

[Moonbear]

hmmm well my gf of a year and I took the briggs myers test for fun and we are near opposites according to the test. But I do really think we balance each other out. I am passive, calming and "aloof". She is direct, organized and nervous. But so far it's worked out :)



Same here, we recognize our differences and celebrate them. We are both pretty grounded and intelligent so we make sure to understand and not let a difference ruin everything.

I think the two of you make a very good couple. Not that we spent long together, but considering you had both just made a long car trip together and were still both smiling and talking to each other, that must mean something.

 

[Astronuc]

I think the two of you make a very good couple. Not that we spent long together, but considering you had both just made a long car trip together and were still both smiling and talking to each other, that must mean something.

Ah yes - the long distance driving test! That's a good one, and very practical.

My wife and I did a road trip together just after we got engaged. One of her professor's needed to have a car transferred from Houston to Chicago. My wife volunteered us. We took a side trip to Indiana to visit one of her old girl friends. It was a fun.

She did express her concern about the way I would let the gas tank get pretty low (I like to maximize range between fill ups), and she wasn't too pleased about the speed, but she still married me after that.

 

[DaveC426913]

Ah yes - the long distance driving test! That's a good one, and very practical.

My wife & I both love car trips. I love driving and she loves being driven. We're both fairly cerebral and enjoy the quality time taking.

One of our fave weekend activities is long day trips. And we routinely go 1500 miles on week holidays.

 

[Artaxerxes]

One enters into a marriage by one's volition - i.e. it's a choice, it's voluntary.

Marriage is a contract into which two parties enter both giving something (themselves) in order to received something (some consideration, which is supposed to be an exclusive relationship in most cases (unless one party is polygamous)).

Marriage requires effort, just like any relationship, or activity. When one gardens, one cultivates the ground, plants the seeds or seedlings, waters and fertilizes regularly, weed the ground, and then harvests the produce. The ground doesn't prepare itself, and plants don't plant or harvest themselves.

Marriage is about giving and receiving tender loving care (TLC).

But as we have seen many examples, marriage may not be for everyone.

Can't two parties give and receive without a governmental involvement?
Can't they cultivate the seeds on their own?
Giving and receiving tender loving care - doesn't that work without governmental regulations?
If there is love - just live together, and if you want others to know that you are a couple then you can have some sort of ceremony advertising your relation if you feel for it...but there should be no legal implications.
And when that tender feeling is dead and gone just say goodbye ... no court...no hell.

 

[Astronuc]

Can't two parties give and receive without a governmental involvement?

Sure - it's called cohabitation. On the other hand, some state (in the US, and perhaps elsewhere) have common-law statutes that legally protect the rights of individuals.

Can't they cultivate the seeds on their own?
Giving and receiving tender loving care - doesn't that work without governmental regulations?
If there is love - just live together, and if you want others to know that you are a couple then you can have some sort of ceremony advertising your relation if you feel for it...but there should be no legal implications.
And when that tender feeling is dead and gone just say goodbye ... no court...no hell.

The legal implications come from sharing property and assets.

Ideally two people get married because they love each other, which means among many things respect and honesty. Sadly, that sometimes isn't the case.

When I was getting married, my best friend was furious with me because he thought I should live with my then fiance and wait to see if it worked out. He refused to be best man at the wedding (a small private affair with family and friends), because he disagreed with marriage. He was living with his girlfriend who was my wife's best friend. She wanted to get married, especially after my wife and I got married, and my best friend didn't. They eventually got married and then divorced after several years.

I've been married for 25+ years, and been with the same woman 26+ years.

tender feeling is dead and gone

Well, funny thing about me - the tender feeling toward the women I have known never dies - but lives within me forever. I still care about all those women in my past, and I hope each is doing well with the paths and relationships they chose.

 

[DaveC426913]

Can't two parties give and receive without a governmental involvement?
Can't they cultivate the seeds on their own?
Giving and receiving tender loving care - doesn't that work without governmental regulations?
If there is love - just live together, and if you want others to know that you are a couple then you can have some sort of ceremony advertising your relation if you feel for it...but there should be no legal implications.
And when that tender feeling is dead and gone just say goodbye ... no court...no hell.

1] Whatever floats their collective boat. Let's try to remember that, when we state our opinions, they are merely that, and no one needs to feel their own opnion is being trod upon.


2] I know that, if my wife and I had not been married, we would quite likely not be together now. We've been through some pretty rough times - times that brought us close to the edge. If parting ways was something that could be enacted by only one of us (say, by merely moving out), it would have been easier. It was a logical hurdle that caused us to give great pause about crossing it.

We came back from that edge and now we both know we'll be together for our natural lives. In fact, it even makes our fights dwindle. Many fights that might have continued, just don't. What's the point? We love each other and we're not going anywhere. We have a mutual trust.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

my best friend was furious with me because he thought I should live with my then fiance and wait to see if it worked out. He refused to be best man at the wedding (a small private affair with family and friends), because he disagreed with marriage. He was living with his girlfriend who was my wife's best friend. She wanted to get married, especially after my wife and I got married, and my best friend didn't.

He was furious with you because you blew his program!

 

[Astronuc]

To the man I married

because you let me know you completely
because you are still a mystery

because you do not wish to change me
because you have changed me forever

because you see the good and true in me
because you forgive all else in me

because you are not who I expected to love
because you are just who I need to love

because you gave me beautiful yesterdays
because you promise me beautiful tomorrows

because you asked for my hand
because I gave you my heart

I love you.

I think she loves me.

 

[Moonbear]

Can't two parties give and receive without a governmental involvement?
Can't they cultivate the seeds on their own?
Giving and receiving tender loving care - doesn't that work without governmental regulations?
If there is love - just live together, and if you want others to know that you are a couple then you can have some sort of ceremony advertising your relation if you feel for it...but there should be no legal implications.
And when that tender feeling is dead and gone just say goodbye ... no court...no hell.

Actually, the most useful function of a legal marriage rather than cohabitation is to protect you when you split up. The legal divorce proceedings are in place to help you figure out how to divide up your shared assets and disentangle your liabilities. It would be very difficult to have any sort of long-term cohabitation arrangement that kept both of your assets entirely separate and wouldn't lead to a real mess if you decided it was time to head your separate ways. Legal marriage has nothing to do with commitment and love, and everything to do with protecting property and income and determining how to fairly divide it should you be unable to stay together any longer. It provides other legal protections as well (i.e., medical decision-making in the event one or the other partner is incapacitated to make decisions for themselves).

So, I'm taking the question more generically to refer to "what's it like to live with one person the rest of your life," rather than specifically requiring it be in the context of legal marriage.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

To the man I married

because you let me know you completely
because you are still a mystery

because you do not wish to change me
because you have changed me forever

because you see the good and true in me
because you forgive all else in me

because you are not who I expected to love
because you are just who I need to love

because you gave me beautiful yesterdays
because you promise me beautiful tomorrows

because you asked for my hand
because I gave you my heart

I love you.

I think she loves me.

Mine says:

"To the man I married

Make run to the dump

Paint livingroom

Landscape hillside

Put up insulation in pump house

... etc, etc, etc"

 

[Moonbear]

To the man I married

because you let me know you completely
because you are still a mystery

because you do not wish to change me
because you have changed me forever

because you see the good and true in me
because you forgive all else in me

because you are not who I expected to love
because you are just who I need to love

because you gave me beautiful yesterdays
because you promise me beautiful tomorrows

because you asked for my hand
because I gave you my heart

I love you.

I think she loves me.

Mine says:

"To the man I married

Make run to the dump

Paint livingroom

Landscape hillside

Put up insulation in pump house

... etc, etc, etc"

I think Astronuc got the better deal there.

 

[Astronuc]

I think Astronuc got the better deal there.

Well - it was my birthday.

 

[Chi Meson]

My wife has a strong personality in some ways, and I have a strong personality and attitude (but no ego), but we work it out.

This is I think, the key.

My wife, Pam, has a very strong personality. She has two master's degrees: one in Chemistry, one in English Literature. She runs ultramarathons. She says I have a strong personality. We do have egos as well, but they are not overbearing. Neither of us have any claim to be "in charge," and neither expect the other to be "in charge."

We were married for 7 years before we had our first (of three) kids. This was not by design, but I think it's good advice. We made it through the first 7 without a single argument. I am serious. Nothing worse than "Hey! I was watching that!"

I think we were very lucky to have met. When I first thought about marriage, I didn't have to "weigh the pros and cons," there was clearly no reason not to get married. If you have any inner voice saying that marriage to this person is not the right thing to do, listen to it. There should be no question.

And I didn't buy her a ring, I bought her a bicycle.

Next week is our 14th anniversary. Still no arguments that lasted longer than a minute.

 

[turbo]

This is I think, the key.

My wife, Pam, has a very strong personality. She has two master's degrees: one in Chemistry, one in English Literature. She runs ultramarathons. She says I have a strong personality. We do have egos as well, but they are not overbearing. Neither of us have any claim to be "in charge," and neither expect the other to be "in charge."

We were married for 7 years before we had our first (of three) kids. This was not by design, but I think it's good advice. We made it through the first 7 without a single argument. I am serious. Nothing worse than "Hey! I was watching that!"

I think we were very lucky to have met. When I first thought about marriage, I didn't have to "weigh the pros and cons," there was clearly no reason not to get married. If you have any inner voice saying that marriage to this person is not the right thing to do, listen to it. There should be no question.

And I didn't buy her a ring, I bought her a bicycle.

Next week is our 14th anniversary. Still no arguments that lasted longer than a minute.

What a great story! My wife and I have been together for going on 33 years, with little more that a bump here and there. If one of us is upset about something, it takes nothing more than "I love you" to open a dialog and square things.

 

[Evo]

Those are examples of GOOD RELATIONSHIPS! That's what I've been talking about.

Relationships where you feel like you're treading on eggshells, always trying to avoid an argument, giving in, giving up on things you enjoy, being afraid of saying or doing the wrong thing, those are BAD relationships. Learning how to endure a bad relationship is unhealthy, but a lot of people make a lot of money off of promoting ways to prolong them.

 

[Moonbear]

Those are examples of GOOD RELATIONSHIPS! That's what I've been talking about.

Relationships where you feel like you're treading on eggshells, always trying to avoid an argument, giving in, giving up on things you enjoy, being afraid of saying or doing the wrong thing, those are BAD relationships. Learning how to endure a bad relationship is unhealthy, but a lot of people make a lot of money off of promoting ways to prolong them.

Yep, this thread is making me feel all warm and squishy now. It's nice to hear about good relationships.

 

[JasonRox]

I just don't feel like being tied down. Atleast not now anyways.

It's great to hear nice stories and how well people get along together.

I'm at the point where I want to explore and do things I'm on my own. Yeah, I can have someone by my side (in a good relationship), but I'll miss out on other things I haven't done yet.

 

[momentum_waves]

Here's a question for the wise:

A man has a committed relationship with a woman in a foreign country, where he may not legally own land. He marries her in the understood communal system of the country, which allows each to bring assets into the relationship & recognises a 50:50 split of the joint fruits of the relationship should it dissolve.

The man enters in full faith & trust.

A year, or so into the relationship, they 'jointly' purchase land, meaning he puts up the funds & she signs the paperwork. This is all based on trust. They plan to develop a joint life together into the future.

A year down the track, the man finds out that the woman's family have misappropriated the land, with her full knowledge. This fact had been hidden from the man.

Based on this scenario, could, or should the man consider retaining a long-term relationship with the woman? In other words, how does the 'trust' element & violation thereof enter the life-equation. Remember, the rules of engagement of the two cultures are poles apart.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Those are examples of GOOD RELATIONSHIPS! That's what I've been talking about.

Well, I think those relationships sound great, but I think it is fantasy for everyone to expect the same. For example, no one could spend 14 years with me and never have a disagreement lasting longer than a minute. Heck, I spend more time than that arguing with myself!

I don't think I have ever known a couple that didn't have a fight now and then.

 

[Moonbear]

I just don't feel like being tied down. Atleast not now anyways.

It's great to hear nice stories and how well people get along together.

I'm at the point where I want to explore and do things I'm on my own. Yeah, I can have someone by my side (in a good relationship), but I'll miss out on other things I haven't done yet.

I think that's a completely normal feeling when one is still young ("young" being a relative term). However, my experiences in "good" relationships have been that I didn't miss out on anything, but rather I had someone to enjoy them with me (or to stand behind me while I took some big risks, knowing they'd be there to catch me if I fell, which encouraged doing things I might have "played it safe" on had I not had them as a safety net). However, I think that if you find the right person, this won't even be an issue any longer, and until you've found her, keep on doing what you're doing and having fun on your own.

 

[Chi Meson]

However, I think that if you find the right person, this won't even be an issue any longer, and until you've found her, keep on doing what you're doing and having fun on your own.

Bingo.

Chances are, if you ever were to "find her," she'll be in those places that you want to go.

 

[Astronuc]

Here's a question for the wise:

A man has a committed relationship with a woman in a foreign country, where he may not legally own land. He marries her in the understood communal system of the country, which allows each to bring assets into the relationship & recognises a 50:50 split of the joint fruits of the relationship should it dissolve.

The man enters in full faith & trust.

A year, or so into the relationship, they 'jointly' purchase land, meaning he puts up the funds & she signs the paperwork. This is all based on trust. They plan to develop a joint life together into the future.

A year down the track, the man finds out that the woman's family have misappropriated the land, with her full knowledge. This fact had been hidden from the man.

Based on this scenario, could, or should the man consider retaining a long-term relationship with the woman? In other words, how does the 'trust' element & violation thereof enter the life-equation. Remember, the rules of engagement of the two cultures are poles apart.

Based on the deception, it would appear that the woman does not love the man, but rather took advantage of him. That would seem to preclude a healthy long-term relationship. The man seems committed, but the woman does not.

To love someone is to care about them and respect them, and in the situation described, it seems one way. The man cares for the woman and hopes for the same in return, but the deception would indicate that is not the case.

Would the man consider becoming a citizen of the other country? Is the woman willing to marry him? Would that marriage be a good one?

 

[Astronuc]

Chances are, if you ever were to "find her," she'll be in those places that you want to go.

That is an excellent point. One has a chance of encounter potential mates/partners with similar interests.

I'm in Ivan's camp. I needed someone who could work with me, and so a strong personality helps.

Neither of us have any claim to be "in charge," and neither expect the other to be "in charge."

I prefer shared responsibilities, and sharing the mundane tasks of everyday living.

Relationships where you feel like you're treading on eggshells, always trying to avoid an argument, giving in, giving up on things you enjoy, being afraid of saying or doing the wrong thing,

Well, we actually went through periods like that, particularly early on. My wife had a lot of issues left over from her parents relationship, and I didn't fully understand it. There were times when I felt like I was d@****d if I did, d@****d if I didn't, but I was determined to persevere. This is why communication is SO important. We eventually resolved things and improved the communication.

We waited to have children because we were both in grad school, and I was working full time as well as going to school and teaching (primarily to pay of my wife's school loans and pay for our grad school programs). My daughter was born just before I left grad school and took my first job. That was very stressful, because the job required long hours and travel, which cut into my ability to be available to my family.

 

[momentum_waves]

A very wise answer indeed.

Would the man consider becoming a citizen of the other country? Is the woman willing to marry him? Would that marriage be a good one?

I'll have to ask him.

Based on knowledge of the situation, (1) I'd estimate he'd find it almost impossible to become a citizen of said country due to limited, or almost non-existent naturalization policies. (2) She would probably marry him as an ongoing ATM account & for her convenience. (3) Given her past behavior, I doubt the marriage would be wise & I expect he'd agree to this.

This property ownership issue has caused tremendous difficulties in such countries as Thailand, for instance.

I brought it up as an example of what can go wrong, especially between folks of differing cultures & norms. The exercise of caution & discretion would be wise in such situations. The relationship would need to be tested on its merits before solid commitments were to ever be made.

 

[JasonRox]

I think that's a completely normal feeling when one is still young ("young" being a relative term). However, my experiences in "good" relationships have been that I didn't miss out on anything, but rather I had someone to enjoy them with me (or to stand behind me while I took some big risks, knowing they'd be there to catch me if I fell, which encouraged doing things I might have "played it safe" on had I not had them as a safety net). However, I think that if you find the right person, this won't even be an issue any longer, and until you've found her, keep on doing what you're doing and having fun on your own.

Yeah, it's definitely great to have someone with you. I do feel like being on my own now is important for me though.

At the very least, have great friends to share life with.

 

[Urvabara]

I am too old to learn these social things. Never had a girlfriend. I am shy and I do not drink/smoke... :shy:

I will probably be a hermit...

I hope that I will be Ph.D. in Physics. That's the most important thing in the life...

 

[whitay]

Heh. I've never had a girlfriend and it means **** all seriously. drink or smoke, i never a lot of alcohol until i came to germany, now I've got my hands around a lot of vodka and beer drinking. But like don't drink to much beer that **** does werid stuff to you body and you need to have a lot of **** next morning to get used to a lot of vodka.

Just because you want to study physics doesn't mean you are going to be a hermit or nerd or some bull****. You just got to be like, I'll get some friends and then Ill chill with them and stuff and then in your spare time study physics etc. I mean if you only ever have one girlfriend and it turns to be your one true love then good on you, you kick a lot of peoples arse at the dating game.

I mean age is a number seriously. Nothing more than a number. The people who use that number and give it pseudo-value are F U C K E D. I mean seriously if some says 'umm you are to old' or 'umm you are to young', F U C K E M, they are just jugding you an everyone else by there number. When they probably can't even add 45 and 23 together fast enough.

Don#t, don't, don't, don't get your self down or something because well you arn't exactly like someone else. You were never met to be like them. Be you and show people you.

Back to the topic, if you get married at 25 or 65 it don't matter. i mean I am 19 and i cannot imagine getting married 25. my indicator to get married is when my skin turns rinkly and flabby and I am just ready to do some really chilling time.

like i got less then 6hours sleep last night. 2 were on the couch at a friends place after i had drunk alittle to much and couldn't be bothered playing poker anymore. I don't remember getting home. But i remember brushing my teeth and waking up at 7am wearing everything still, my jacket and everything. My camera, phone and wallet were still in my pocket. Then i had to get ready and ride my bike 3km to the next town and then back for my germancourse and dam was i wreak. Can you married guys do that? if so it might not be so bad.Later