Capacitance and distance between plates

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between capacitance and the distance between capacitor plates, as well as the connection between capacitance and work done in a capacitor. The original poster presents equations related to capacitance and attempts to derive relationships involving work and energy.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the proportionality of capacitance to the inverse of the distance between plates and explore how this affects energy and work. There are attempts to relate work done to energy using various equations, and questions arise regarding the correct bounds for integration in energy calculations.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the concepts, providing insights and questioning the assumptions made about energy and work. Some guidance has been offered regarding energy equations, but there is no explicit consensus on the correct approach or final outcome.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of confusion regarding the use of symbols and the definitions of work and energy, as well as the need for clarity on the integration bounds in the context of energy calculations.

soopo
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Homework Statement


The question is at
http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/175564/capacitance.JPG


Homework Equations


Q = CV
C = [tex]\epsilon_{0} A / d[/tex]

The Attempt at a Solution



The right solution is Q^2 / C that is (h).

I know that C is proportional to the inverse of the distance between plates.
Thus, I suggests that the capacitance should one third of the original value.

The other problem is to have a relation between capacitance and work.
I know W=Fd, where we get a relation to capacitance by d.
This suggests me that the work should one third of the work done with the initial distance between plates in the capacitor.

How would you solve the problem.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
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Hi soopo! :smile:
soopo said:
I know that C is proportional to the inverse of the distance between plates.
Thus, I suggests that the capacitance should one third of the original value.

Yes, that's right! :smile:
The other problem is to have a relation between capacitance and work.
I know W=Fd …

You're making it very complicated :redface:

work done is energy …

the https://www.physicsforums.com/library.php?do=view_item&itemid=75" getting from one state to another is the difference in energy between them (in a conservative system)

So, although, as you say, work done = ∫force.distance (= ∫charge.voltage), it's much easier to use the standard energy equation for a https://www.physicsforums.com/library.php?do=view_item&itemid=112", which is … ? :smile:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
tiny-tim said:
Hi soopo! :smile:Yes, that's right! :smile:You're making it very complicated :redface:

work done is energy …

the https://www.physicsforums.com/library.php?do=view_item&itemid=75" getting from one state to another is the difference in energy between them (in a conservative system)

So, although, as you say, work done = ∫force.distance (= ∫charge.voltage), it's much easier to use the standard energy equation for a https://www.physicsforums.com/library.php?do=view_item&itemid=112", which is … ? :smile:

The equation seems to be

W = .5 CV^2

It seems to be obtained by integrating CV with respect to V.
The problem is now to know the upper and lower bounds for the voltage in the integral.
I suggest that the upper one is infinity and the lower one is zero.

If the formula is right, then
V^2 = 2Q / C

However, I cannot see how to get the result.
This suggests me that the equation for the work done in the capacitor is not correct.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Hi soopo! :smile:

(try using the X2 tag just above the Reply box :wink:)
soopo said:
The equation seems to be

W = .5 CV^2

It seems to be obtained by integrating CV with respect to V.

(whyever are you using W for energy? :confused:)

No, it's obtained either by integrating ∫(1/2)QEdx or ∫QVdQ … see the PF Library on https://www.physicsforums.com/library.php?do=view_item&itemid=112"

Anyway, since Q = CV, the energy can also be written .5 Q2/C, which should give you the result almost immediately. :wink:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
tiny-tim said:
Hi soopo! :smile:

(try using the X2 tag just above the Reply box :wink:)


(whyever are you using W for energy? :confused:)

No, it's obtained either by integrating ∫(1/2)QEdx or ∫QVdQ … see the PF Library on https://www.physicsforums.com/library.php?do=view_item&itemid=112"

Anyway, since Q = CV, the energy can also be written .5 Q2/C, which should give you the result almost immediately. :wink:


Thank you for your answers!
 
Last edited by a moderator:

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