Conservation laws in a curve spacetime

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the conservation laws derived from the energy-momentum tensor for a perfect fluid in curved spacetime, specifically examining the implications of the equation \(\nabla_b T^{ab} = 0\). Participants explore the relationships between density, pressure, and the motion of fluids in a general relativistic context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the explicit component form of the conservation equation and its implications for conservation laws. There are attempts to relate the problem to familiar equations in flat spacetime, such as the Navier-Stokes equations, and to consider the role of symmetries and Killing vectors in defining additional conservation laws.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided guidance on how to manipulate the energy-momentum tensor to derive conservation equations. There is an ongoing exploration of whether additional conservation laws exist beyond the covariant divergence of the energy-momentum tensor, with some suggesting that symmetries could lead to further insights. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being discussed, particularly regarding the necessity of a metric for certain calculations.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the absence of a specific metric, which complicates the application of certain concepts, such as Killing vectors. This constraint is acknowledged as a limitation in deriving some conservation laws.

Magister
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Homework Statement



Given the energy-momentum tensor for a perfect fluid, what is the conservation laws that I can compute from

[tex] \nabla_b T^{ab}=0[/tex]

in a curve space-time.

Homework Equations



[tex] T^{ab}=(\rho + p) u^a u^b - p g^{ab}[/tex]

where p is the pressure and [itex]\rho[/itex] is the density.

The Attempt at a Solution



I have already compute the geodesic equation, the equivalent to the equation of motion in a flat space-time.
I would like to know if there is any other conservation law to get. I supose that might be another one equivalent to the Navie-Strokes in flat space-time...

Thanks in advance
 
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Just write [tex]\nabla_b T^{ab}=0[/tex] explicitly in components (in terms of density, pressure and scale factor). You will get a conservation type eqn.
 
Dick said:
Just write [tex]\nabla_b T^{ab}=0[/tex] explicitly in components (in terms of density, pressure and scale factor). You will get a conservation type eqn.

In terms of scale factor? The problem is that they don't give me a metric. I don't know what to with the [itex]g^{ab}[/itex] term...
 
I guess I was thinking of the problem in FRW background. Can you simplify anything w/o a metric? Not sure...
 
Well. I have already compute the equation of motion, in a curve space, from [itex]\nabla_b T^{ab}=0[/itex]. So I suppose that there may be another one...
 
In general, there isn't any other conservation law, besides the covariant divergence of the energy-momentum tensor. However, if you have a space-time with a continuous symetry, there's a Killing field defined on the space-time, associated to that symettry. It can then serves to define another conservation law, in a similar way as a Noether current.
 
What about this:

[tex] <br /> \nabla_b T^{ab}=\nabla_b((\rho + p) u^a u^b) - g^{ab} \nabla_b p = 0<br /> [/tex]

where I have used [itex]\nabla_b g^{ab} = 0[/itex]

[tex] u^a \nabla_b((\rho + p) u^b) + (\rho + p) u^b \nabla_b u^a -g^{ab} \nabla_b p = 0[/tex]

[tex] u_a u^a \nabla_b((\rho + p) u^b) + (\rho + p) u^b u_a \nabla_bu^a -g^{ab} u_a \nabla_b p = 0[/tex]

using the fact that [itex]\nabla_b (u_a u^a) = \nabla_b 1 \Leftrightarrow 2 u_a \nabla_b u^a = 0[/itex], I get

[tex] \nabla_b((\rho + p) u^b) = g^{ab} u_a \nabla_b p[/tex]

using this in the second equation I get

[tex] (\rho + p) u^b \nabla_b u^a = 0[/tex]

or

[tex] \nabla_u u^a = 0[/tex]

So I can saw that the equation of motion (a conservation law) can be derived from [itex]\nabla_b T^{ab}=0[/itex].
Am I wrong?

In general, there isn't any other conservation law, besides the covariant divergence of the energy-momentum tensor. However, if you have a space-time with a continuous symetry, there's a Killing field defined on the space-time, associated to that symettry. It can then serves to define another conservation law, in a similar way as a Noether current.

Just has I said above, they don't give me any metric, so I can't compute the Killing vectors.
 
Last edited:
From equation

[tex] <br /> \nabla_b T^{ab}=\nabla_b((\rho + p) u^a u^b) - g^{ab} \nabla_b p = 0,<br /> [/tex]

you get the following :

(1) [tex] \nabla_a ((\rho + p) u^a) = u^a \nabla_a p,[/tex]

AND :

(2) [tex] (\rho + p) u^a \nabla_a ( u^b) = (g^{ab} - u^a u^b) \nabla_a p.[/tex]

In the case of a pressureless gaz, p = 0, and you get the conservation of "matter" AND the geodesics equation :

(3) [tex] \nabla_a (\rho u^a) = 0,[/tex]

AND :

(4) [tex] u^a \nabla_a ( u^b) = 0.[/tex]There's no need of any particular metric to define conserved quantites with the Killing fields.
 

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