Control theory: process given, PID settings

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the design of a closed-loop control system for a given process, focusing on the selection of an appropriate controller (P, PI, PID, or PD) and the necessary settings to meet specific control loop requirements, including zero steady-state error, infinite gain margin, and a phase margin of 40 degrees. The context is primarily technical and homework-related.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • The initial poster suggests that to achieve zero steady-state error, an integrator action is necessary, and to maintain infinite gain margin, the phase must not cross -180 degrees.
  • They propose that both integrator and derivative actions are required, leading to the conclusion that a PID controller is the most suitable choice.
  • Another participant questions how to achieve infinite gain margin, expressing uncertainty about the concept.
  • One participant interprets the infinite gain margin as potentially undefined, noting that the phase must remain above -180 degrees, but admits a lack of knowledge on the terminology used.
  • A suggestion is made to position zeros and poles at specific frequencies to shape the response magnitude graph, referencing external material for guidance.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the concept of infinite gain margin and the terminology used, indicating a lack of consensus on how to achieve the specified control requirements. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple viewpoints presented.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about the process dynamics and the specific definitions of gain and phase margins. The mathematical steps to derive the controller settings are not fully explored.

Engineer_s
Messages
11
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



Problem:

We want a closed loop control loop for the given process (see bode plot), the control loop requirements are:
  • Steady state error needs to be zero.
  • The gain margin needs to be infinite.
  • The phase margin needs to be 40 degrees.
Questions:
  1. Which controller will be the best choice: P, PI, PID or PD and why?
  2. What are the controller settings needed to reach the requirements for the controller you have chosen.
The bode plot of the process is given:

sFJcIgc.jpg


Homework Equations



Standard controllers in de Laplace domain.

The Attempt at a Solution



My attempt to find a solution:
  • Steady state error needs to be zero. ==> We need an integrator action
  • The gain margin needs to be infinite. ==> the phase is not allowed to cross the -180°.
  • The phase margin needs to be 40 degrees. ==> phase margin at 0 dB crossing.
Since the phase of the process is below -180° we need an extra null in the open loop equation. Therefore we need an derivative action (D-action). This will result in a phase that never crosses the -180°. Since we both need an I-action and D-action the appropriate controller will be a PID-controller.

How can I find the appropriate settings for my controller?

Thanks in advance for helping me out!
 

Attachments

  • sFJcIgc.jpg
    sFJcIgc.jpg
    48.6 KB · Views: 792
Physics news on Phys.org
Anyone?:frown:
 
I think he means undefined, since he concludes that the phase must stay above -180. I'm afraid that I don't know enough of the subject to know if that is the common way to say it.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman

Similar threads

Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
4K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
4K
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
5K