Cylindrical rotor generator power under loss of excitation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the power generation capabilities of turbo alternators, specifically focusing on the behavior of cylindrical rotor generators under conditions of loss of excitation. Participants explore the differences between salient and non-salient pole rotors in this context, examining the implications for real power production.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether non-salient pole generators can produce real power under loss of excitation, noting that these generators lack the saliency necessary to develop reluctance power.
  • Another participant references a video that discusses loss of excitation but acknowledges it primarily addresses salient pole rotors, indicating a need for clarification regarding non-salient pole behavior.
  • A different participant suggests that while non-salient pole generators should not be connected to the grid without field excitation due to the risk of high voltages, shorting the field may allow some power generation as an induction machine, although this practice is not commonly reported for large generators.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the capabilities of non-salient pole generators under loss of excitation, with no consensus reached on whether they can operate effectively in such conditions.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexities of generator operation under loss of excitation, with various constraints mentioned but not fully resolved. The implications of shorting the field and the operational limits of different rotor types remain unclear.

niaz
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Hello all,

I want to know about turbo alternator real power producing capability under loss of excitation condition.

Normally in salient pole rotor have capability to supply real power under field current=0 condition, as there is reluctance power developed. But what about non salient pole generator? there is no saliency. So, there is not possibility to develop reluctance power. Does it mean that, this type of turbo generator is totally prohibited to run under loss of excitation condition?
 
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anorlunda said:
:welcome:

I found this cool video that should answer your questions.

https://www.slideshare.net/mmuralintpc/loss-of-excitation
Thank you for your reply. I have watched this presentation before. Look very carefully this presentation, here also described about "salient Pole Rotor" alternator. But I need the behavior of "None salient Pole rotor" during this situation.
 
Think of this figure from the video. It applies to both round rotor and salient pole synchronous generators.
There are many constraints on generator operation. Many of them are seen in this figure.
loss-of-excitation-22-638.jpg
 

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niaz said:
Does it mean that, this type of turbo generator is totally prohibited to run under loss of excitation condition?
You'd certainly not want it connected to the grid with no field .
As it develops slip high voltages induced in the field will wreck something.
Shorting the field would allow some power generation as an induction machine with amortisseur windings and shorted field carrying rotor current. But i don't know of anyone who's done that with a generator of any size. Some synchronous motors are started that way, though.
 
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Thank you for cooperations
 

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