Why does damping affect the time period of SHM oscillators?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of damping on the time period of simple harmonic motion (SHM) oscillators, specifically focusing on springs and pendulums. Participants explore the implications of damping on the oscillation period, questioning the applicability of standard equations in real-world scenarios.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the time period for damped oscillators should be the same as for undamped oscillators based on standard equations, while others challenge this view by noting that damping significantly alters the behavior of the system.
  • One participant highlights that the equations for springs and pendulums are approximations, with the pendulum equation being valid only for small angles, suggesting that real pendulums do not exhibit true SHM.
  • Concerns are raised about whether an underdamped system oscillates at the same period as an undamped system, with one participant stating that it does not and that the period changes over time.
  • There is a discussion about the nature of damping forces, with different types of damping (constant amplitude, proportional to velocity, etc.) affecting the oscillation characteristics differently.
  • One participant mentions that for low levels of damping, the change in frequency is minimal, but as damping increases, the frequency can approach zero, leading to a cessation of oscillation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between damping and the time period of oscillators. There is no consensus on whether damped systems can be considered to undergo true SHM, and the discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of damping on the time period.

Contextual Notes

The discussion acknowledges limitations in the standard equations for SHM, particularly regarding their applicability to real-world scenarios and the assumptions underlying their derivation.

jsmith613
Messages
609
Reaction score
0
There are two equations that can describe the time period of SHM oscillators (springs / pendulums ONLY)

Spring T = 2π * \sqrt \frac {m}{k}

Pendulum T = 2π * \sqrt \frac {l}{g}

It would seem from these equations that time period is independent of amplitude
therefore we should be able to conclude that the time period for a damped oscillator is the same as that for an undamped oscillator.

BUT if you oscillate something viscous (water, oil, tar) then then time period is massively increased.

My questions are
(a) would an underdamped system oscillate at the same period as an un-damped system?
(b) how come the equations of SHM and reality don't match up (damped systems are still undergoing SHM...I think)
(c) will the time period change in the damped system during the oscillations? i.e: could it start at 0.5s and then increas to 1s
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
First point - the equations you state are approximations. The spring one assumes the spring is within its elastic limit and Hookes law strictly applies (not to bad a condition in the real world). The pendulum equation is more of a problem. It is only valid if the pendulum oscillation is through an infinitestimaly small angle.
So real a real pendulum does not execute true SHM and its period is affected by its amplitude.

In answer to your questions

a) No and the period changes with time
b) Damped systems are not undergoing true SHM hence the mismatch
c) Yes

If you are familiar with Fourier transforms you can take the transform of the equation of motion of the damped system and see the change in period directly.

Hope this helps

Regards

Sam
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: gracy
The way the system behaves depends how it is damped. Different physical processes can produce damping forces that are constant amplitude (but change direction every half cycle of oscillation), proportional to velocity, or proportional to veloicty squared - or even more complicated behaviour.

The simplest to analyse is damping proportioal to velocity, and in that case the damped frequency is constant for the whole motion, but is lower than the frequency without damping. For systems with low levels of damping like a mass oscillating on a spring, the change in frequency is small (typically less than 1%) but as the damping increases the "frequency" eventually drops to zero and there is no oscillation at all, just a motion in one direction that slows down as the system approaches its equilibrium position.

All this is well known and covered in college-level courrses on dynamics, but as in any subject you have to learn to walk before you can run, and a first course in dynamics often only includes undamped SHM.
 
thanks all
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 36 ·
2
Replies
36
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
904
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 131 ·
5
Replies
131
Views
8K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
4K