Period of anharmonic oscillator

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    Oscillator Period
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the period of an anharmonic oscillator, specifically focusing on the potential \( V(x) = x^4 \). Participants explore the mathematical formulation of the period, its divergence for small amplitudes, and the physical implications of this behavior. The conversation includes aspects of numerical solutions, Taylor expansions, and the limitations of harmonic oscillator approximations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a numerical solution for the period \( T \) of the potential \( V(x) = x^4 \) and notes that it diverges for small amplitudes \( a \).
  • Another participant suggests that the divergence may be related to the flatness of the potential at small values of \( a \) and \( x \).
  • There is a discussion about the physical interpretation of the period \( T \) as the starting position approaches zero, with some noting that the potential becomes flat and the particle hardly slides.
  • A participant recalls that any potential around a local minimum can be approximated by a harmonic oscillator potential and questions its application in this case.
  • Another participant introduces the idea that starting at the minimum point could imply \( T = 0 \), leading to a singularity in the period calculation.
  • There is a challenge regarding the Taylor expansion of the potential and its implications for the harmonic oscillator approximation, with a focus on the conditions under which it holds.
  • A participant notes that for the quartic potential, the Taylor expansion leads to a situation where the harmonic oscillator approximation yields \( T = 0 \) or \( T = \infty \) everywhere, depending on the proximity to zero.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the divergence of the period and the applicability of the harmonic oscillator approximation. There is no consensus on the physical interpretation of the results or the conditions under which the approximations are valid.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on the definitions of the potential and the sensitivity of measurements. The discussion highlights unresolved mathematical steps regarding the Taylor expansion and the conditions for the harmonic oscillator approximation to be applicable.

ChrisVer
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Well I numerically solved for the potential V(x)=x^4, the period:
\begin{equation}
T = \sqrt{8m} \int_0^a \frac{dx}{\sqrt{V(a) - V(x)}}
\end{equation}

where a was the amplitude of the oscillation and m the mass of the particle.
Nevertheless, what I was asked to plot was the above period T(a) for a\in [0.,2.].
My problem however is that the period of small values of a, diverges. I was able to see how this is the case mathematically, by expanding the square root and obtaining an expression for T that goes for V(x)=x^p as:
T \sim \frac{1}{a^{p/2-1}}
which reproduces also the V=x^2 result of constant period.

However I cannot picture what is happening physically. Does it have to do with the flatness of the potential at so small a's and so x's?
Any idea?
 
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Imagine the potential curve as a literal valley, with the particle a small object sliding along the surface.
You start the object stationary at x=a, let it go, and measure how long it takes to return... and call that number T.
What happens to T as the start position gets closer to zero?
 
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Simon Bridge said:
Imagine the potential curve as a literal valley, with the particle a small object sliding along the surface.
You start the object stationary at x=a, let it go, and measure how long it takes to return... and call that number T.
What happens to T as the start position gets closer to zero?

yup, the potential is pretty flat as you move to smaller x...so the body will "hardly" slide...
in explicitly a\rightarrow0 \Rightarrow T \rightarrow \infty

But then again, I remember some quote saying that any potential around a (local) minimum can be described to a good approximation by an Harmonic Oscillator potential with the minimum at that point... (Taylor expanding the potential around the local minimum)...What about its application to this case?
 
The other interpretation to starting at the minimum point is that T=0 because it take no time at all to return to it's start position.
So there is a singularity there :)

An arbitrary potential can be expanded in a Taylor series, and it is common to take low order's of that series as an approximation.
So have you taken the taylor expansion for your potential to see what the first few terms are?
 
Simon Bridge said:
So have you taken the taylor expansion for your potential to see what the first few terms are?
Oh I see... I tried to but I was carried away and didn't think that the 2nd order of the expansion that I [only] kept was also vanishing.
so it's not a rule for all types of potentials, rather than those who move slower than V''(x_0) \ne 0...
so from power potentials V(x)= x^p no p \ge 3 can be described by an harmonic oscillator...
 
V(x) = x^4

expanding as a taylor series about x=a:

##V(x) = 4a^3(x-a) + 6a^2(x-a)^2 + 4a(x-a)^3 + 1(x-a)^4 + 0 + 0 + \cdots##... put a=0.
##V(x) = 0 + 0 + 0 + x^4 + 0 + 0 + \cdots## ... surprise surprise.

This is telling you that the HO approximation to the quartic potential is V=0.
In this approximation: T=0 or infinity everywhere.
The approximation is valid for x "sufficiently close to" 0 ... how close is "sufficient" depends on the sensitivity of your instruments.
It's like how the approximation that the Earth is flat is really good inside a typical room but not if you are looking from orbit.
 

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