Deriving Function for Acceleration of Block on a Spring as a Function of Time?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around deriving a function for the acceleration of a block attached to a spring as a function of time, a(t). Participants explore the relationship between the forces acting on the block, the spring constant, and the displacement of the block over time, considering both external forces and the resulting motion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes the equation (F-K*s)/m=a but struggles to express displacement s as a function of time t.
  • Another participant asserts that acceleration is indeed a function of displacement, suggesting that knowledge of kinematics is necessary.
  • A different participant corrects the initial equation, stating that the only unbalanced force is -ks, leading to the equation -ks/m = a, indicating that this is a second-order differential equation.
  • Some participants argue that the external force F must be included in the equation, emphasizing that its nature influences the type of motion (e.g., simple harmonic, damped, or driven harmonic motion).
  • One participant suggests replacing acceleration 'a' with the second derivative of displacement and solving the differential equation to find s as a function of t, but notes the importance of understanding the external force F.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity and role of the external force F in the equations, leading to multiple competing interpretations of the system's dynamics. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the correct formulation of the equations and the implications of the external force.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions made about the nature of the external force F and its impact on the motion of the block. The discussion also highlights the dependence on definitions of terms like displacement and acceleration in the context of the problem.

einaap
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Hi fellow physicists,
Suppose a spring with a stiffness k, is attached to wall and with the other side a block with a mass, m, a force F, then pulls the block away from the wall. How do you derive a function for acceleration of the block as a function of time, a(t)?
When trying to solve this I derived the equation: (F-K*s)/m=a but I don't know how to derive a function of s (displacement) as a function of t (to substitute for s in previous equation). The problem seems to be that s(t) is in its turn again a function acceleration which is a function of how far the spring is stretched which is a function of displacement, s :)
Does anyone know how to do this? Thanks
 
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Yes, you are right, acceleration is a function of displacement but you should know what this function is from kinematics.
 
einaap said:
Hi fellow physicists,
Suppose a spring with a stiffness k, is attached to wall and with the other side a block with a mass, m, a force F, then pulls the block away from the wall. How do you derive a function for acceleration of the block as a function of time, a(t)?
When trying to solve this I derived the equation: (F-K*s)/m=a but I don't know how to derive a function of s (displacement) as a function of t (to substitute for s in previous equation). The problem seems to be that s(t) is in its turn again a function acceleration which is a function of how far the spring is stretched which is a function of displacement, s :)
Does anyone know how to do this? Thanks
There should be no F in the equation that you wrote. The only unbalanced force is -ks and this should be equal to ma, So your equation should read -ks/m = a. As you can see, and as paisiello2 pointed out, this shows that the acceleration depends on s. This is a second order differential equation whose solution gives you s as a function of t.
 
No, I think F is an externally applied force so there is an F in the equation.
 
paisiello2 said:
No, I think F is an externally applied force so there is an F in the equation.
Agreed. But if there is an extra applied force in addition to -kx, then it may no longer be simple harmonic motion. The solution of s as a function of t will depend on what F is. for example, if the spring and object are hanging vertically from the ceiling, F would be gravity, and you would still have simple harmonic motion. If F is friction, it would damped harmonic motion, and if F is itself an oscillatory motion, then you would have a driven harmonic oscillator.
 
einaap said:
Hi fellow physicists,
Suppose a spring with a stiffness k, is attached to wall and with the other side a block with a mass, m, a force F, then pulls the block away from the wall. How do you derive a function for acceleration of the block as a function of time, a(t)?
When trying to solve this I derived the equation: (F-K*s)/m=a but I don't know how to derive a function of s (displacement) as a function of t (to substitute for s in previous equation). The problem seems to be that s(t) is in its turn again a function acceleration which is a function of how far the spring is stretched which is a function of displacement, s :)
Does anyone know how to do this? Thanks

Replace acceleration 'a' with ## \frac{d ^2s}{dt^2}## in your equation and solve this differential equation. Then you will find s as a function of t. Then differentiate it twice. You will get the answer. But at first you have to know about the nature of external force F.
 

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