Does light bend due to gravitational tides?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of whether light bends due to gravitational tides, particularly in relation to the effects of extreme mass on the path of photons. Participants explore theoretical implications, wave behavior, and the nature of light in the context of gravity and relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that the vibration of light could cause it to bend around massive objects, suggesting a tidal gravity effect that might be detectable alongside relativistic bending.
  • Another participant challenges the notion that light behaves as a transverse wave and asserts that photons do not vibrate side to side.
  • It is mentioned that gravity does bend light, but the reasoning provided by the first participant is deemed incorrect, with a suggestion to consider Huygens principle for a more accurate understanding.
  • A further response clarifies that sine waves represent electric and magnetic field vectors rather than the path of a photon, emphasizing the complexity of associating a path with a photon and recommending a focus on classical electromagnetic waves instead.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the nature of light and its behavior in gravitational fields, with no consensus reached on the proposed tidal gravity effect or the interpretation of light as a wave.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the nature of photons, the applicability of classical wave descriptions, and the implications of quantum mechanics on the discussion.

newjerseyrunner
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I was wondering if the way that light vibrates causes it to bend slightly while moving around an object with extreme mass (on top of the bend caused by relativity.) I was drawing what I thought the path of a photon should be around a massive object, but the uncertainty principal bugged me. Am I correct that a photon can be in any location along it's wave function? I imagine a photon like a rubber band, constantly stretching and snapping back at it's frequency and magnitude depending on it's energy.

So if I draw the path as a sine-wave with it's average path being a straight line in the middle of it, the crests of the sine wave are closer to the massive object than the troths. Wouldn't this cause a tidal gravity effect that would be detectable above the bending caused by relativity, and the size of the wave would cause larger waves like radio to be bent more than high energy waves? Or does the photon act as though it's precisely on it's mean trajectory?
 
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Although light is often drawn as if it were a transverse wave, even in the classical description, it is not one. Nor does a photon vibrate from side to side.
 
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newjerseyrunner said:
So if I draw the path as a sine-wave with it's average path being a straight line in the middle of it, the crests of the sine wave are closer to the massive object than the troths.

The sine waves are graphical representations of the strength and directions of the magnetic and electric field vectors associated with an EM wave. In other words, the sine waves tell you which direction the force from each component points and how strong it is at any point in time. A photon does not move in a squiggly, sine wave pattern. You can't really associate a path with a photon anyways, but that gets into some complicated quantum physics. I recommend sticking to classical EM waves and not trying to figure out what a photon will do.
 

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