Dynamic system - initial displacement

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the dynamics of a system with initial displacement, particularly focusing on the role of initial displacement in the equations governing the system's response to an impulse. Participants explore the implications of initial conditions in the context of Laplace transforms and the behavior of damped systems.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why the initial displacement is included in the damper term but not in the spring term, suggesting it should be represented as k(X-x0) instead of kX.
  • Another participant emphasizes the need to assume whether the system is over- or underdamped, proposing underdamping as a more interesting case for analysis.
  • There is a discussion about the nature of the impulse δ(t) and its dimensional implications, with a suggestion to modify the impulse to maintain dimensional consistency in the equations.
  • A later reply clarifies initial conditions, stating that if the position of the bar before the impulse is applied is set to zero, the initial conditions are x(0) = x'(0) = 0, which simplifies the analysis.
  • One participant notes that the massless nature of the bar leads to a first-order system, which alters the complexity of the equations involved.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the treatment of initial displacement in the spring term, with no consensus reached on whether it should be included or not. The discussion also reflects differing views on the system's damping characteristics and the implications of initial conditions.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not resolved the assumptions regarding the system's damping state or the specific treatment of initial displacement in the equations. There are also unresolved mathematical steps related to the application of Laplace transforms and the implications of the system being massless.

MMCS
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Please see attached for question.

My problem is the initial displacement.

i am told the first step is this

kx + c(dx/dt) = unit impulse

laplace transform

kX + c(sX-x0)=1

from that i can see the initial displacement is included in the damper but why isn't it included in the spring term e.g i would expect it to be k(X-x0)

can anybody explain this?

Thanks
 

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First, you have to make an assumption as to whether the system is over - or - underdamped. Let's assume underdamping since that's more fun ...

Second, you should understand what is meant by "an impulse δ". Actually, it's δ(t), signifying that an impulse is applied at t = 0. More importantly, the dimension of δ(t) is T-1 so your F = ma equation will be dimensionally incorrect if you don't modify the impulse.

Your actual impulse is bδ(t) where b = 1 Newton-second if you're using the SI system. I suggest retaining the "b" in your work so you can check dimensional consistency term-by-term.

OK, so now you write your F = ma equation, transform to the frequency (Laplace) domain, and solve for X(s) and then x(t).

I hope you have a Laplace table that includes the underdamped second-order case. If not you'll have to use partial-fraction expansion with complex roots. Yuk!

OR, you can just assume overdamped in which case the poles are both real and you can use partial fraction expansion easily.
 
Thank you for your reply Rudeman, but i am still unsure specifically about including the initial displacement in the equation

would the spring term include the initial displacement e.g k(x-x0)

or would it just be kx

with an explanation of why if possible,

Thanks
 
Ʃ
MMCS said:
Thank you for your reply Rudeman, but i am still unsure specifically about including the initial displacement in the equation

would the spring term include the initial displacement e.g k(x-x0)

or would it just be kx

with an explanation of why if possible,

Thanks

Let x = 0 be the position of the bar before the impulse is applied. So your initial conditions are x(0) = x'(0) = 0.

EDIT: the fact that the bar is massless makes this a first-order system, making things a whole lot easier. So your equation is ƩF = ma = 0. This makes the math very easy. Sorry that didn't dawn on me earlier. So also ignore my bit about having to assume underdamping or overdamping. There are no oscillations possible with m = 0.
 
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