Efficiency of Ramp Pulling: Friction vs. No Friction

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the efficiency of pulling a cart up a ramp under two scenarios: with friction and without friction. The original poster is exploring whether the efficiency in the frictionless case should be less than in the case with friction, based on their lab results.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to calculate efficiency and questions the determination of effort force in a frictionless scenario. Some participants discuss the relationship between work done by pulling forces and gravitational forces, while others clarify the implications of constant speed on effort force.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the relationship between forces and work in both scenarios. There are differing interpretations regarding the effort force and its calculation, indicating a productive exploration of the concepts involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants are considering the implications of constant speed and the absence of friction, as well as the specific parameters of the ramp and cart involved in the problem.

cheerspens
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Homework Statement


In an ideal case of pulling a cart up a ramp where there is no friction should the efficiency be less than that of pulling a cart up a ramp with friction?

Homework Equations


W=F[tex]\Delta[/tex]Xcos[tex]\theta[/tex]
Efficiency=(work output/work input)*100

The Attempt at a Solution


I was trying to calculate this for a lab and my efficiency came out to be much less for a friction-less ramp than one with friction. Is this possibly right?
What I believe one of my problems was, was determining the effort force. How do you determine the effort force if you only know that there is no acceleration, no friction, the length of the ramp is 1.22 m and the mass of the cart is 0.783 kg?
 
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Let's say you pull a cart up an incline at constant speed.

If there is no friction, then all the work your muscles do matches the negative work done by gravity and nothing else.

If there is friction, then the work that your muscles do matches the negative work done by gravity and the negative work done by friction.

The effort force is the sum of all the other forces when the object is moving at constant speed. This is a consequence of the work energy energy theorem.
 
So if there is no friction and the force of gravity is say 8 N, then the effort force is 8 N?
 
I didn't say the forces are equal. If there is no friction, the work done by gravity is equal to the work done by the pulling force. The forces will be equal only if the cart is pulled vertically up. Use the definition for work to see why this is so.
 

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