Elastic or inelastic collision?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the classification of a collision as elastic or inelastic, particularly in scenarios where two objects collide and stick together. Participants explore the definitions and implications of kinetic energy conservation in different types of collisions, including the nuances of momentum conservation and the conditions under which energy may or may not be conserved.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that if the initial kinetic energy equals the final kinetic energy, the collision must be elastic, regardless of whether the objects stick together.
  • Others argue that sticking together is not a definitive condition for inelastic collisions, and that kinetic energy conservation is the key factor in determining the type of collision.
  • A participant points out that conservation of momentum applies to both elastic and inelastic collisions, suggesting that if the objects stick together, kinetic energy cannot be conserved.
  • Another viewpoint introduces the possibility of external forces affecting the collision, which could alter the conservation of energy dynamics.
  • Some participants discuss the interpretation of "stick together," with one suggesting that it implies the objects have the same velocity post-collision, while another considers scenarios involving rotational motion that could complicate this interpretation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definitions and implications of elastic and inelastic collisions. There is no consensus on whether the scenario described can be classified definitively as one type of collision over the other, indicating ongoing disagreement.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the importance of definitions and assumptions in discussing collision types, noting that interpretations may vary based on the specific conditions described.

Mohamad
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If the initial kinetic energy is equal to the final kinetic energy where two objects that collide stick together, this collision is elastic or inelastic?
 
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What collision scenario do you have in mind ?
 
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Mohamad said:
Summary: elastic or inelastic collision?

If the initial kinetic energy is equal to the final kinetic energy where two objects that collide stick together, this collision is elastic or inelastic?
Clearly you do not understand the basic definitions of elastic and inelastic collision. You could at least look those up before proceeding.
 
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An "elastic collision" is, by definition, one in which kinetic energy is conserved. Since, in an inelastic collision, we don't have the "conservation of kinetic energy" equation, we need another condition to solve for the speeds after the collision. Often that is given by requiring that the two objects stick together, but that is not necessary. We can have an inelastic collision in which the two objects do not stick together and we can have an elastic collision in which the two objects do stick together. Here, we are given that kinetic energy is conserved so this has to be an elastic collision.
 
HallsofIvy said:
An "elastic collision" is, by definition, one in which kinetic energy is conserved. Since, in an inelastic collision, we don't have the "conservation of kinetic energy" equation, we need another condition to solve for the speeds after the collision. Often that is given by requiring that the two objects stick together, but that is not necessary. We can have an inelastic collision in which the two objects do not stick together and we can have an elastic collision in which the two objects do stick together. Here, we are given that kinetic energy is conserved so this has to be an elastic collision.
I thought we weren't supposed to spoon-feed the answers. :frown:
I had already asked him to look up the defintions so that he could figure that out for himself.
 
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Using conservation of momentum (which holds regardless if the collision is elastic or inelastic,unless there is net external force which is comparable in magnitude with the magnitude of the big forces that arise due to collision) we can prove that IF the two bodies stick together then the kinetic energy isn't conserved.

So your scenario is contradictory. Either the bodies don't stick together, or the kinetic energy isn't conserved, you can't have both. OR there are external forces in play.
 
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Delta2 said:
So your scenario is contradictory. Either the bodies don't stick together, or the kinetic energy isn't conserved, you can't have both. OR there are external forces in play.
Or the objects were spinning just right so that they could latch onto one another without dissipating any energy. They can then spin about one another, each retaining its original (and rotational) kinetic energy in the combined center-of-momentum frame.
 
jbriggs444 said:
Or the objects were spinning just right so that they could latch onto one another without dissipating any energy. They can then spin about one another, each retaining its original (and rotational) kinetic energy in the combined center-of-momentum frame.
The way I interpreted "stick together" is that they have exactly the same velocity after the collision. In the scenario you describe they don't have the same velocity after the collision (spinning about one another means they have opposite and equal velocities (in the best scenario) if I understand it properly)
 
Delta2 said:
The way I interpreted "stick together" is that they have exactly the same velocity after the collision. In the scenario you describe they don't have the same velocity after the collision (spinning about one another means they have opposite and equal velocities (in the best scenario) if I understand it properly)
Yes, the typical assumption with "stick together" is a head-on collision, ignoring the possibility of a resulting rotation. But a literal reading of the problem statement in #1 above allows the possibility.
 

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