Electric potential distribution in a volume of varying conductivity

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the electric potential distribution in a liquid with varying conductivity, particularly in the context of inserting two wires into the liquid and measuring voltage with a voltmeter. Participants explore the implications of adding a conductive bar into the system and how it affects voltage readings, addressing both theoretical and practical aspects of the problem.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about the voltage readings in different parts of the tank when measuring close to the probes.
  • Another participant suggests solving Poisson's equation for potential distribution, noting that without the metal bar, an analytic solution is possible.
  • It is mentioned that the introduction of a metal bar complicates the situation, and a numeric simulation might be necessary, especially if the bar is long or occupies a significant fraction of the distance between the probes.
  • A participant expresses a need for an online tool to visualize potential distribution, indicating a preference for an order of magnitude estimation rather than a precise solution.
  • One participant provides an equation for potential distribution in a two-dimensional system, emphasizing the need for the wire diameter to be much smaller than the distance between the probes.
  • Another participant seeks clarification on how to measure voltage when varying the measuring point along both the x and y axes.
  • A clarification is made regarding the notation used in the potential equation, indicating that the distance calculation involves both x and y components.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to calculate the potential distribution with the added metal bar, and multiple viewpoints on the complexity of the problem and potential solutions remain. There is also uncertainty regarding the availability of tools for visualizing the solution.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the assumption of a two-dimensional system and the dependence on the specific configurations of the wires and the metal bar. The discussion does not resolve the mathematical steps necessary for a complete solution.

eman3
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Hey,
Assume I have a very large tank of some liquid with uniform but medium conductivity.
I now insert two fine wires into the tank some distance (D) apart, and create an electrical potential difference between them (V).

1) If I were to take my voltmeter (input impedance very high, so we assume it draws no current itself), with its two fine-tipped probes fairly close together (<<0.1 * D), what would the voltage readings look like in different parts of the tank?

2) Now, let's say I drop a flat bar of metal (much more conductive than the liquid) somewhere in the tank between the original probes. How does it affect the voltmeter readings from 1) if the bar is very short? If the bar is long enough to occupy some significant fraction of D?
 
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You can calculate the potential distribution by solving Poisson's equation in the tank and fixing the potential at the metal wires. Without the metal bar, you get a nice, analytic solution, and you can calculate the potential everywhere. The voltage depends on the positions of the probes.

With the metal bar, it is more complicated, and I think a numeric simulation of the system would be the easiest way, unless the bar follows some area of constant potential or has some other special positions. If it is very short, it might be negligible.
 
Thanks. Having failed DiffEq twice when I took that class, is there e.g an online tool that will generate a nice graphic showing how the solution looks?

I don't need a precise solution, just an order of magnitude estimation...
 
If your system is two-dimensional (or does not have significant variations in the third dimension) and the wires are identical, the potential V(x) should be approximately V(x) = c\, \left( ln(|x-x_1|) - ln(|x-x_2|)\right) where x1 and x2 are the positions of the wires and c is chosen to get the correct potential at the wire surfaces. You will need the diameter of them. The approximation assumes that the wire diameter is << D.

Excel can produce nice color gradients, and I don't know any online tools.
 
mfb -- thanks, but I'm looking to figure out V(x,y). Your equation gives me an idea of what voltage measurement I might get as I vary the measuring point along the x-axis (assumed to be a straight line between the two wire probes). But what happens if I vary the measuring point along the y-axis as well?
 
x has two components in my equation. |\vec{x}-\vec{x_1}| is a short version for \sqrt{(x-x_1)^2+(y-y_1)^2} and I dropped the vector arrows. That was a bit sloppy.
 

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