Electron moving to lower energy state

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    Electron Energy State
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of electrons in atoms when transitioning between energy states, specifically focusing on the emission and absorption of photons. Participants explore the conditions under which electrons can move to higher energy states and the implications of these transitions in various contexts, including atomic behavior and astrophysical phenomena.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that when an electron moves to a lower energy state, it emits a photon, and if a photon with the correct energy is absorbed, the electron can move back to a higher energy state.
  • Others argue that while it is possible for an electron to be excited to a higher energy level, this process is not common due to the rapid emission of photons, which balances the absorption.
  • There is a mention that the absorption of two low-energy photons simultaneously is theoretically possible but extremely unlikely, requiring intense laser conditions for significant rates of multi-photon absorption.
  • One participant notes that the continuous emission and absorption of photons prevent electrons from constantly moving to higher energy states.
  • Another participant questions the concept of "favorable direction" in relation to photon absorption, clarifying that energy does not have direction, but electromagnetic field vectors do.
  • A later reply highlights that such transitions occur continuously in the outer layers of the Sun's atmosphere, contributing to observable phenomena like dark Fraunhofer lines in the solar spectrum.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the basic principles of photon absorption and emission but express differing views on the frequency and conditions under which these processes occur. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specifics of multi-photon absorption and the implications of energy directionality.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include the dependence on specific conditions for photon absorption, the complexity of electronic transitions in molecules compared to single atoms, and the need for precise energy matching for excitation.

Simon Peach
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When an electron moves to lower energy state it emits a photon, now if a photon is absorbed by an electron does the electron move back to the higher energy state. (I don't think that 'energy state' is the right term) If so how hard is it to put the photon into the electron? I assume that it not an everyday occurrence as then all electron would be endless moving up.
 
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Simon Peach said:
When an electron moves to lower energy state it emits a photon, now if a photon is absorbed by an electron does the electron move back to the higher energy state.

If the photon has the right amount of energy, equal to the difference in energy between the two levels, then yes, the electron can be excited into the higher energy level.

Simon Peach said:
If so how hard is it to put the photon into the electron? I assume that it not an everyday occurrence as then all electron would be endless moving up.

It is very easy to do. This isn't a problem because the vast majority of the time the electron quickly falls back down from its excited state, releasing that energy either as light or as heat. Also, every excitation would require light of a different wavelength and the chances of the atom absorbing light with exactly the right energy in exactly the right order at exactly the right time is very small.

Also note that there are essentially no single atoms roaming about around you. Almost all atoms are locked into molecules of gas, liquids, or solids. Molecules have several more ways to absorb and release energy other than electronic transitions, and their electronic transitions are often complex, multi-state processes.
 
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Atoms are constantly emitting and absorbing photons. The electrons don't constantly go up in energy because they are typically emitting photons as fast as they are absorbed.

Drakkith said:
Also note that there are essentially no single atoms roaming about around you.
You probably have some argon atoms around you.
 
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Khashishi said:
You probably have some argon atoms around you.

Ah yes, I forgot about the argon in the atmosphere.
 
Can low energy photons make an exitation exception if they are ver very close and all their energies point to favourable direction?
 
Can you rephrase that, m k? I can't understand you.
 
m k said:
Can low energy photons make an exitation exception if they are ver very close and all their energies point to favourable direction?

As far as I know, absorption of two photons of lower energy at exactly the same time is possible, but extremely unlikely. Also, energy is not a vector, it does not have a direction. Perhaps you mean the electromagnetic field vectors, but those are not really related to the energy levels of an atom.
 
Drakkith said:
As far as I know, absorption of two photons of lower energy at exactly the same time is possible, but extremely unlikely.
In other words, you need intense lasers to get significant rates of multi-photon absorption.
 
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Simon Peach said:
I assume that it not an everyday occurrence as then all electron would be endless moving up.
It occurs continuously in the outer layers of the Sun's atmosphere. This is what creates the dark Fraunhofer lines in the solar spectrum.
 
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