News Examining the Validity of Sexual Harassment Claims in the Media

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The discussion centers on the validity of sexual harassment claims against Herman Cain, with participants expressing skepticism about the allegations and criticizing media coverage. Some argue that the accusations are exaggerated, citing a lack of physical contact and framing the situation as a politically motivated attack from the left. Concerns are raised about Cain's handling of the allegations, suggesting that his responses have worsened the situation. The conversation also touches on the implications for Cain's political future, with some predicting that any dishonesty could end his candidacy. Overall, the thread highlights the contentious nature of sexual harassment claims in the political arena and the media's role in shaping public perception.
DoggerDan
Cain and sexual "harassment"

The media feels it needs to give every item "equal time." Thus, a presidential sneeze gets 30 seconds, the same as bronchitis. I once had the "audacity" to tap a female subordinate on the shoulder to get her attention. Why did I have to touch her? She was wearing earphones on the job, which entailed monitoring and using radios, which she couldn't hear because she was listening to her iPod. Before I tapped her on her shoulder, I queried her twice, once in a normal tone of voice, the second rather loudly, much louder than the radios she was supposed to be monitoring. One guess as to her response to my directing her to ditch her iPod while on the job. Fortunately, two witnesses were right there and emphatically supported the truth, so her idiotic effort backfired before it began. The fact that she claimed sexual harassment despite the fact that two witnesses were right there underscores her idiocy. Perhaps she thought it might help keep her from being fired.

Nope.

As for Cain, no physical contact was involved, which tells me it's the liberal, ant-right media which is digging up this speck of dust and shouting it from the mountaintops. This behavior gives the media a VERY bad name, as well as anyone else who joins in the shouting.
 
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Wow. Really? A sexual harassment suit because you tapped someone on the shoulder?
 


This has Karl Rove written all over it.
 


There's an old saying - the truth will set you free.

I think this will backfire on the Left - given their earlier defense of President Clinton through his scandals. EVERYBODY can see the hypocrisy in this matter - one more reason not to trust the main stream media.

On the other hand - if Cain is covering up any part of the story - he's done. People will understand and forgive a bumbling/fumbled but truthful response as he's embarrassed and uncomfortable with the topic - but they won't tolerate a lie.

Romney/Gingrich 2012 is looking like the ticket.
 


I don't know if the charge has merit, but he has so far botched the response effort.
 


russ_watters said:
I don't know if the charge has merit, but he has so far botched the response effort.

Might be making it worse now.
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...consultant-for-his-harassment-scandal/247799/

"As the scandal surrounding Herman Cain's alleged sexual harassment problem takes on a life of its own, the former pizza titan is hitting back with accusations that the story was a hit job from Rick Perry's campaign."
 


DoggerDan said:
As for Cain, no physical contact was involved, which tells me it's the liberal, ant-right media which is digging up this speck of dust and shouting it from the mountaintops. This behavior gives the media a VERY bad name, as well as anyone else who joins in the shouting.

Where did you hear no physical contact was involved? Do you know who the source was for this story or are you just blaming the usual suspects (the liberal, ant-right media)?
 


If he wants to be a politician but he can't handle thiis sort of stuff, he's failed. The truth or falsity of the allegations is as irrelevant as whether Obama is really a Martian who converted to Islam.
 


skeptic2 said:
Where did you hear no physical contact was involved? Do you know who the source was for this story or are you just blaming the usual suspects (the liberal, ant-right media)?

Politico broke the harassment story.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/67398.html
 
  • #10


Have Reverend Al and Jesse Jackson weighed in on this yet?
 
  • #11


DoggerDan said:
As for Cain, no physical contact was involved, which tells me it's the liberal, ant-right media which is digging up this speck of dust and shouting it from the mountaintops. This behavior gives the media a VERY bad name, as well as anyone else who joins in the shouting.

Ah, so you were there when this happened, I take it, otherwise there's no way you could know whether physical contact was involved or not. Please fill us in on what really happened.
 
  • #12


The guys on the right are correct, this will backfire on the left.

The right loves the Herman Cain controversy because it deflects attention away from Perry and Romney eating their own to the 'liberal media conspiracy' against a candidate who never had a chance against Romney anyway.
 
  • #13


chaoseverlasting said:
Wow. Really? A sexual harassment suit because you tapped someone on the shoulder?

I had a similar situation to the OP where me (a male) and a male subordinate came around the corner too quickly and collided. I instinctively put my hands on his arms and steadied each other and guided him around me. He reported the contact to HR whom called me and wanted an explanation. I gave them myside of the story and never heard anything of it again. He was getting fired in a few days for repeated performance failures (he had a specific goal after several months of evaluations and was very far from meeting it), and I think he saw the writing on the wall so was doing any little thing to keep a foothold.

On Cain - I agree he's handling it very poorly. It's hard to reply to oddball accusations without drawing extra attention to them (but at the same time addressing them).
 
  • #14


DoggerDan said:
As for Cain, no physical contact was involved, which tells me it's the liberal, ant-right media which is digging up this speck of dust and shouting it from the mountaintops. This behavior gives the media a VERY bad name, as well as anyone else who joins in the shouting.

So you're trying to tell us that physical contact is required for it to be sexual harassment?
The EEOC defines sexual harassment as:
Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, or other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature when:
1. Submission to such conduct was made either explicitly or implicitly a term or condition of an individual's employment,
2. Submission to or rejection of such conduct by an individual was used as the basis for employment decisions affecting such individual, or
3. Such conduct has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with an individual's work performance or creating an intimidating, hostile, or offensive working environment.
1. and 2. are called "quid pro quo" (Latin for "this for that" or "something for something"). They are essentially "sexual bribery", or promising of benefits, and "sexual coercion".
Type 3. known as "hostile work environment," is by far the most common form. This form is less clear cut and is more subjective.[6]
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_harassment#United_States_2"

Given that the EEOC is the enforcement agency responsible for dealing with claims of unlawful sexual harassment, I'd say their definition supersedes yours.

Your argument appears to go like this:
"I touched a woman at work once and she cried foul. Because I wasn't sexually harassing her, someone else must touch a woman for it to be sexual harassment."

It's a complete non-sequitur. And that's ignoring the fact that you have no idea of any of the details of what actually happened.
 
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  • #15


chaoseverlasting said:
Wow. Really? A sexual harassment suit because you tapped someone on the shoulder?

Never made it past her complaint to HR. They got statements from the witnesses before showing them to her as they fired her.

mege said:
On Cain - I agree he's handling it very poorly. It's hard to reply to oddball accusations without drawing extra attention to them (but at the same time addressing them).

Agreed. His best response should have been something along the lines of "it was investigated and dismissed." It's not the sort of topic one wants to spend hard-earned media time discussing at length.
 
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  • #16


WhoWee said:
Might be making it worse now.
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...consultant-for-his-harassment-scandal/247799/

"As the scandal surrounding Herman Cain's alleged sexual harassment problem takes on a life of its own, the former pizza titan is hitting back with accusations that the story was a hit job from Rick Perry's campaign."

Which is very problematic for Cain - first he says he was unaware of any sexual harrassment lawsuit against him, then later says one of his former advisors leaked the story to Perry's camp - either way, he lied then or is doing so now (by lie, I mean lied about knowing if there was a suit, not that it actuall happened).
 
  • #17


daveb said:
Which is very problematic for Cain - first he says he was unaware of any sexual harrassment lawsuit against him, then later says one of his former advisors leaked the story to Perry's camp - either way, he lied then or is doing so now (by lie, I mean lied about knowing if there was a suit, not that it actuall happened).

Your claim rests on the false assumption that human memories are perfect.

Mine's not. I've reviewed Cain's interviews on this subject, and they're smack dab in line with the way the human brain remembers relatively un-rememberable events.
 
  • #18


At this point, there are 2 anonymous women another anonymous woman that has been cleared to speak but chooses not to and instead has a spokesperson lawyer?
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/05/u...lls-of-harassment-pattern-lawyer-attests.html

""WASHINGTON — The lawyer for one of the women who accused Herman Cain of sexual harassment said Friday that Mr. Cain engaged in a “series of inappropriate behaviors and unwanted advances” toward his client over two months in the 1990s, and he directly accused Mr. Cain, a Republican presidential candidate, of not telling the truth about his behavior.
The lawyer, Joel P. Bennett, who represents a former employee of Mr. Cain’s at the National Restaurant Association, said the accusations did not center on a single exchange that could be easily misinterpreted, which is how Mr. Cain has characterized it. Mr. Bennett said there were multiple episodes that led his client to file a formal complaint with the restaurant association.

If this woman is unwilling to testify (and unless this lawyer was a witness to events spread over a 2 month period) - perhaps Cain or (more appropriately) the National Restaurant Association should hold the lawyer's feet to the fire?

Actually, at this point there's no proof the lawyer actually has a client. The National Restaurant Association continues to suffer damages to it's reputation every time the lawyer speaks - something it sought to avoid when it settled nearly 20 years ago. The damages to the National Restaurant Association (actually a global enterprise) may be hundreds of millions of dollars.
 
  • #19


WhoWee said:
There's an old saying - the truth will set you free.

I think this will backfire on the Left - given their earlier defense of President Clinton through his scandals. EVERYBODY can see the hypocrisy in this matter - one more reason not to trust the main stream media.

On the other hand - if Cain is covering up any part of the story - he's done. People will understand and forgive a bumbling/fumbled but truthful response as he's embarrassed and uncomfortable with the topic - but they won't tolerate a lie.

Romney/Gingrich 2012 is looking like the ticket.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/nov/03/herman-cain-woman-45000-payout

Romney and Perry are the left, now?

In another setback, Cain's team backed off its claim that rival Rick Perry's team had originally planted the story in a dirty tricks operation. Cain had blamed a Perry strategist, Curt Anderson, as the source.

But Cain's team on Thursday was forced into a climbdown after Anderson denied it. Anderson said he had known nothing about the sexual allegations until he read about them on Politico.

He added that he continued to have enormous respect for Cain and would not speak negatively about him either on or off the record.

Mark Block, Cain's campaign chief, said: "Until we get all the facts, I'm just going to say that we accept what Mr Anderson has said, and we want to move on with the campaign."

Anderson had worked for Cain as a consultant in a failed bid for the Senate in 2004. Cain's team claim he was briefed at the time about the sex harrassment allegations.

Perry's team suggested that another rival, Mitt Romney, might have been the culprit, noting that one of Romney's big donors was in the restaurant industry.

To be fair, Cain has nothing to back up his suspicions about Perry and Romney except that people in their campaign staff could have known about the incidents. But thinking this was leaked by "the left" is equally unfounded at this point.
 
  • #20


BobG said:
To be fair, Cain has nothing to b...[B]He clearly did something wrong.[/B]" "[/I]
 
  • #21


that's some bold speculation
 
  • #22


DoggerDan said:
Your claim rests on the false assumption that human memories are perfect.

Mine's not. I've reviewed Cain's interviews on this subject, and they're smack dab in line with the way the human brain remembers relatively un-rememberable events.

Perhaps so, but if I were to ever be accused of this, I wouldn't ever call it "un-rememberable".
 
  • #23


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_...uses-cain-of-sexually-inappropriate-behavior/

This is someone new, who it appears never pursued it but felt the need now to talk about it.
While I find it abhorrent to try to extort sexual favors with a job offer, I don't find it surprising. While the moral content of our president is an external symbol of our national moral values, I really don't know if I'd refuse to vote for someone SOLELY on an event such as this. But a history of it would show his lack of respect for women, and that IS a huge problem.
 
  • #24


Hepth said:
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_...uses-cain-of-sexually-inappropriate-behavior/

This is someone new, who it appears never pursued it but felt the need now to talk about it.
While I find it abhorrent to try to extort sexual favors with a job offer, I don't find it surprising. While the moral content of our president is an external symbol of our national moral values, I really don't know if I'd refuse to vote for someone SOLELY on an event such as this. But a history of it would show his lack of respect for women, and that IS a huge problem.

I don't know what to think of this - as a long time member of the NRA - I have lot's of questions.
1.) Why wait until now - Cain ran for Senate?
2.) How did Atty Gloria Allred find this woman?
3.) Why was David Axelrod's name connected to hers in Google searches?
4.) Why did she lose her job at NRA before she met Cain under these circumstances - what was going on inside NRA politics?
5.) Was she planning to leave her boyfriend (in NJ?) and move to DC - or did she live in Chicago where the Education foundation and trade shows are based?
 
  • #25


WhoWee said:
I don't know what to think of this - as a long time member of the NRA - I have lot's of questions.
1.) Why wait until now - Cain ran for Senate?
2.) How did Atty Gloria Allred find this woman?
3.) Why was David Axelrod's name connected to hers in Google searches?
4.) Why did she lose her job at NRA before she met Cain under these circumstances - what was going on inside NRA politics?
5.) Was she planning to leave her boyfriend (in NJ?) and move to DC - or did she live in Chicago where the Education foundation and trade shows are based?

In addition she states she told her boyfriend and friend after the incident:
The lawyer said she had two sworn statements from Ms Bialek's then boyfriend, as well as a longstanding friend, who said she had told them about Mr Cain's alleged behaviour shortly afterwards.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-15628860
So 6) Why her boyfriend and friend waited until now?
 
  • #26


DoggerDan said:
Your claim rests on the false assumption that human memories are perfect.

Mine's not. I've reviewed Cain's interviews on this subject, and they're smack dab in line with the way the human brain remembers relatively un-rememberable events.

daveb said:
Perhaps so, but if I were to ever be accused of this, I wouldn't ever call it "un-rememberable".

Actually, I think something like that would be pretty memorable, too. How often do these type of things happen to him that they'd become un-rememberable?

That still doesn't shed any light on what actually happened - it just shows he doesn't want to talk about it. Nor does does the NRA, hence the 5 figure settlements.

Likewise, Chris Matthew's comments aren't exactly bold speculation, even if I don't think Cain definitely did something legally wrong. Something happened that the NRA felt was worth paying out money instead of defending itself (and Cain?) in court. That doesn't mean the women would have won their case. It only means whatever happened would be embarrassing whether they won or lost. I think Matthew's comments are an overstatement, even if not bold speculation.
 
  • #27


rootX said:
In addition she states she told her boyfriend and friend after the incident:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-15628860
So 6) Why her boyfriend and friend waited until now?

Well, to be honest, its more of a "this perv tried to bribe me with a job for "sexual favors"" story that you'd tell your friend. Really doesn't seem like something you rush to the press to talk about.
 
  • #28


Hepth said:
Well, to be honest, its more of a "this perv tried to bribe me with a job for "sexual favors"" story that you'd tell your friend. Really doesn't seem like something you rush to the press to talk about.

Accordingly, why are there 2 sworn statements?
 
  • #30


edward said:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

http://michellemalkin.com/2011/11/0...sharon-bialek-plus-cook-county-court-records/

Ok - coincidence it is. I'll replace that one with how does one place a hand up a (you know what) and pull a head down to (you know where) at the same time - if standing? That sounds very aggressive - why would she ask him to drive her back to her hotel after that encounter? If there is any truth to this - my guess is they knew each other better than either are stipulating.
 
  • #31


WhoWee said:
Ok - coincidence it is. I'll replace that one with how does one place a hand up a (you know what) and pull a head down to (you know where) at the same time - if standing? That sounds very aggressive - why would she ask him to drive her back to her hotel after that encounter? If there is any truth to this - my guess is they knew each other better than either are stipulating.

Who said they were standing. They were sitting in a car. He stopped the touchy feely bit when she ask him to. Who else was going to drive her back to the hotel? They probably did know each other better than either stipulated or she would not have come to him seeking a favor.:devil:
 
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  • #32


edward said:
Who said they were standing. They were sitting in a car. He stopped when she ask him to. Who else was going to drive her back to the hotel? They probably did know each other better than either stipulated or she would not have come to him seeking a favor.:devil:

I just listened to the whole statement. I thought she had said they gotten out of the car. Now more questions - why would the boyfriend send her to see Cain, how/why would he upgrade her room - then ask "why are you here?", why were they drinking and going to dinner, and what was the purpose of visiting closed offices?

If I were in her shoes - just lost a job and wanted to speak to the President about it - the meeting would have been in his office during regular business hours.

Likewise, if I was in Cain's shoes - even when I was single - there wouldn't have been any room upgrades and private drinks and dinners if I didn't know what this former employee had in mind.

The entire affair sounds shady to me.
 
  • #33


WhoWee said:
I don't know what to think of this - as a long time member of the NRA - I have lot's of questions.
1.) Why wait until now - Cain ran for Senate?

Most of the time something like this happens to a woman, it doesn't occur to her that there have been others in the same situation. Seeing this scandal unfold probably gave her the courage to step forward.

Also, frankly, it's humiliating. Especially since she was, in fact, asking him for a favor - maybe she was afraid it would make her look bad. I bet she just wanted it to go away, and pretend it didn't happen.

Btw, she has identified herself as a "registered Republican" (NPR).
 
  • #34


i just want to know if he pulled a Clinton and bit her nose.
 
  • #35


Seriously, how can someone respond to undocumented charges more than a decade later? "She has witnesses". Yea, the entire ACRON organization would make get witnesses for each other, lol. Do you really think the Democratic Party nuts like Soros, MoveOn.org, etc. couldn't set this up on short notice? Remember, none of these "victims" have filed a legal complaint, so they can't be punished for filing a false police report. "Oh, but they put themselves up to public reticule and exposure". Yea, they get to brag to their friends they help sandbag some guy running for president, and make a little money selling the story.

Let’s examine recent history. Voter registration fraud, completed voter ballots mailed out recently in one state by democrats, etc. Is it too hard to image that a popular candidate may have a false claim made against him which is so late it's almost impossible to defend? Anyone remember these same people that hate Cain come to defend Clinton against those false allegations by Flowers, Lewinski, etc.? Even with tapes and Clinton’s “DNA”, they still defended him. With Cain, we only have decade plus old undocumented or discredited claims.
 
  • #36


lisab said:
Most of the time something like this happens to a woman, it doesn't occur to her that there have been others in the same situation. Seeing this scandal unfold probably gave her the courage to step forward.

Also, frankly, it's humiliating. Especially since she was, in fact, asking him for a favor - maybe she was afraid it would make her look bad. I bet she just wanted it to go away, and pretend it didn't happen.

Btw, she has identified herself as a "registered Republican" (NPR).

I just heard an interview with the accuser and Attorney Gloria Allred. She said she talked to Cain at a convention recently and he remembered her. Why would she go to see him at a recent convention? Next, she claims her former boyfriend called to determine if she was one of the anonymous accusers - then encouraged her to contact Atty Gloria Allred - because she needed the best.

The more I hear about this - the more it sounds like a failed date - drinks, dinner, and a room upgraded to a suite - over a weekend?

Perhaps the biggest clue was when she said Cain asked her "why" she was there - this was during drinks and discussion of the room upgrade.

Today she said they previously had a great time (with her boyfriend along) at an NRA convention prior to the bad encounter. They (accuser/boyfriend/Cain) were familiar and social - this time she came alone.

Please note, the NRA food shows/restaurant conventions used to attract over 100,000 people into McCormick Place over the weekend - $10-$15 admission at the door and all the food, beer, wine, and alcohol one cared to consume. Aside from the floor show - elaborate private parties for industry professionals were held in the surrounding hotels. Needless to say - the food and beverage industry know how to throw a great party. This NRA party/event was the basis of their prior relationship - social - not work.
 
  • #37


ThinkToday said:
Let’s examine recent history. Voter registration fraud, completed voter ballots mailed out recently in one state by democrats, etc.

Got sources for that? That's simply opinion unless you back it by legitimate sources.

ThinkToday said:
Anyone remember these same people that hate Cain come to defend Clinton against those false allegations by Flowers, Lewinski, etc.?

Yes, and there are those on the left who didn't believe Clinton, jut as there are some on the right who don't believe Cain. And there were some on the right who immediately (i.e., before any proof) lambasted Clinton, just as there are some on the left who are immediately lambasting Cain.

ThinkToday said:
Even with tapes and Clinton’s “DNA”, they still defended him. With Cain, we only have decade plus old undocumented or discredited claims.

There are actually 2 documented claims, and if they are discredited, perhaps you should support that statement with sources.
 
  • #38


WhoWee said:
The more I hear about this - the more it sounds like a failed date - drinks, dinner, and a room upgraded to a suite - over a weekend?

Failed date? Perhaps. It certainly is weird, whatever it is. On one hand, she claims she went to him for help in seeking a job at the urging of her (now) ex-boyfriend who said he [Cain] appeared impressed with her at a prior meeting, so maybe he [Cain] could help her in finding a job (this is paraphrased from the story I heard yesterday on NPR).

On the other, she met with him for drinks in her hotel lobby (yes, nothing wrong with that) then went for dinner with him driving. Perhaps not the best judgement on her part, but then, I've never been to big meetings like that, so maybe it happens all the time, and it's no big deal.

However, saying she didn't file any claim at the time means she made the whle thing up is speculative at best (not saying you did this WhoWee). Part of the psychology of sexual harrassment is that the female frequently is too embarrassed, has feelings she will be blamed, etc. She may have made the whole thing up, but then gain, she may not have. At this point, I think it's too early to tell one way or the other.
 
  • #39


daveb said:
Failed date? Perhaps. It certainly is weird, whatever it is. On one hand, she claims she went to him for help in seeking a job at the urging of her (now) ex-boyfriend who said he [Cain] appeared impressed with her at a prior meeting, so maybe he [Cain] could help her in finding a job (this is paraphrased from the story I heard yesterday on NPR).

On the other, she met with him for drinks in her hotel lobby (yes, nothing wrong with that) then went for dinner with him driving. Perhaps not the best judgement on her part, but then, I've never been to big meetings like that, so maybe it happens all the time, and it's no big deal.

However, saying she didn't file any claim at the time means she made the whle thing up is speculative at best (not saying you did this WhoWee). Part of the psychology of sexual harrassment is that the female frequently is too embarrassed, has feelings she will be blamed, etc. She may have made the whole thing up, but then gain, she may not have. At this point, I think it's too early to tell one way or the other.

I'm not trying to protect Cain - just make sense of the story. From Cain's perspective ala her description of events:

1.) Cain, accuser and her boyfriend party together at the NRA show. She was an employee but not under his direct supervision and with an escort - not ideal but not a problem.
2.) She loses her job a few months later and she contacts Cain - wants to visit him in DC (should have talked specifics on phone)
3.) She takes a nice hotel room (weekend- he should have questioned what else she was planning-any friends in town?) and they decide to have drinks in the lobby (that's ok - their prior relationship was drinking)
4.) Prior to drinks he upgrades her to a suite (might not have cost him anything - Pres of NRA)
5.) He asks "why" she is there - she lost job and wants his help - apparently not to work with him but back in Chicago. (if this is the correct timeline - he should have hit the brakes if he was thinking about a personal affair)
6.) They go to dinner (ok)
7.) They swing by offices after dinner (might be ok?)
8.) Staying in the car to make a pass - very stupid from his perspective if it occurred as she described. If he wanted to make a pass why not go up to his office (the base of his power) or back to the hotel (suite upgrade and privacy)? This would also be the most offensive and disrespectful place to make a pass from her perspective.
9.) Drove her back to hotel and dropped her off - consistent with a nervous response to a failed pass (alternative was feet on pavement).
10.) Apparently the story ends for him - until she showed up at a recent convention and now with Atty Gloria.
 
  • #40


Sorry if I made it seem like you were defending him - I'm trying to make sense of it too. Then again, I try to make sense of quantum mechanics (my thanks to Feynman for that wonderful quote!)
 
  • #41


daveb said:
Sorry if I made it seem like you were defending him - I'm trying to make sense of it too. Then again, I try to make sense of quantum mechanics (my thanks to Feynman for that wonderful quote!)

No worries - as my AU associates would say.

My guess is politicians everywhere are watching this case - if the new standard is a failed pass 12 years ago?
 
  • #42
It looks like Cain forgot the basic rules of sexual harassment:
http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/sexual-harassment/258532/
 
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  • #43


Apparently this is the recent event the accuser approached Cain at - spoke to him before he took the stage? "Why" is the question at hand.

http://teapartychicago.org/teacon2011

"TeaCon 2011, the first Midwest Tea Party Convention, was held in Schaumburg, Illinois on September 30 and October 1, 2011. The Chicago Tea Party was a proud tea party partner of the event along with the Illinois Tea Party. TeaCon featured Glenn Beck, Andrew Breitbart, Dana Loesch, Steven Crowder, Guy Benson, Ed Morrissey, Republican Presidential Candidate Herman Cain, Congressman Joe Walsh and hundreds of tea party leaders and activists from across the Midwest. "

Why would she approach him (alone) and have a private conversation a few minutes before he took the stage at this event? In interviews, she indicates he recognized her. A radio talk show (witness) said they spoke privately and Cain remained "stone-faced" - just nodded.

Then, a month later, why show up in a news conference with Atty Gloria?
 
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  • #44


daveb said:
Got sources for that? That's simply opinion unless you back it by legitimate sources.



Yes, and there are those on the left who didn't believe Clinton, jut as there are some on the right who don't believe Cain. And there were some on the right who immediately (i.e., before any proof) lambasted Clinton, just as there are some on the left who are immediately lambasting Cain.



There are actually 2 documented claims, and if they are discredited, perhaps you should support that statement with sources.

Sources for mailing out completed ballots can be found in the current news. I don't recall if it was msn.com or foxnews.com that carried the stories of the investigation. Maybe you missed it on the liberal media “news” shows you watch. Voter registration fraud, seriously? Did you watch the news on ACORN and others last election. Did you not know of the high voter turnout for JFK in Chicago…. Cemeteries when he was elected. Try using Google.

lol, "those on the left who didn't believe Clinton". Who? Certainly not in ANY liberal main stream media.

"There are actually 2 documented claims, and if they are discredited, perhaps you should support that statement with sources." <- of what? you do know Clinton left "tracks" on Monica's dress, right? Oh, right, it was planted. As for Flowers et. al., you forget about the tapes she made and those former Clinton adviser Dick Morris made with Bill’s voice?
 
  • #45


My main problem with this entire thing is that it's so long ago, there is no defense available to Cain. Surveillance footage is long gone. Other witnesses that may have been able to come to his defense are lost. Just too murky, too much she said vs. he said. I've been going to conventions, annual meetings, etc. for 30 plus years. No way in hell I can remember what I did, when, where, and with whom, with or without a drink. There are just too many things going on. On top of that, it's one of the dumbest places for an easily recognizable figure (President of NRA) to go wild. Everyone there knows you. Getting to a "room" unseen by surveillance, other guests, etc., not to mention all the people dropping by your room and calls from people that want to meet with you. On top of that, if she was so uncomfortable as to feel harassed, why keep going to talk to him? Going to that showboat Gloria Allred pretty much smells of publicity stunt (fund raiser) for both.
 
  • #46


ThinkToday said:
Sources for mailing out completed ballots can be found in the current news. I don't recall if it was msn.com or foxnews.com that carried the stories of the investigation. Maybe you missed it on the liberal media “news” shows you watch. Voter registration fraud, seriously? Did you watch the news on ACORN and others last election. Did you not know of the high voter turnout for JFK in Chicago…. Cemeteries when he was elected. Try using Google.

You made the claim, therefore the onus of proof is upon you, not me.

ThinkToday said:
lol, "those on the left who didn't believe Clinton". Who? Certainly not in ANY liberal main stream media.

I never claimed mainstream media (and frankly, that was over 10 years ago and I imagine any google search would come up empty because of that)

ThinkToday said:
"There are actually 2 documented claims, and if they are discredited, perhaps you should support that statement with sources." <- of what? you do know Clinton left "tracks" on Monica's dress, right? Oh, right, it was planted. As for Flowers et. al., you forget about the tapes she made and those former Clinton adviser Dick Morris made with Bill’s voice?

And what does this have to do with the documented claims? Your diatribes about Clinton are not proof that the documented claims about Cain have been discredited, as you claimed. Again, where is your proof the claims have been discredited?
 
  • #47


http://www.suntimes.com/8592168-417/sneed-witness-says-cain-accuser-hugged-him-during-tea-party-meeting-a-month-ago.html

◆The encounter: “It looked sort of flirtatious,” said Jacobson. “I mean they were hugging. But she could have been giving him the kiss of death for all I know. I had no idea what they were talking about, but she was inches from his ear.”
 
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  • #48


WhoWee said:
No worries - as my AU associates would say.

My guess is politicians everywhere are watching this case - if the new standard is a failed pass 12 years ago?

Wasn't he married 12 years ago?
 
  • #49


Cain said he doesn't know her...Romney-Gingrich 2012!IMO - Cain needs to spend 100% of his time focused on lawsuits against everyone that has done damage to him. Again, the truth will set him free.
 
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  • #50
edward said:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

http://michellemalkin.com/2011/11/0...sharon-bialek-plus-cook-county-court-records/

She lived in the same apartment building as David Axelrod (President Obama's guy)?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/11/08/cain_accuser_lives_in_same_building_as_david_axelrod.html

"Martha MacCallum, FOX News: "One of the things is that you lived at a 505 North Lake Shore Drive apartment, right? This is the same building, it happens to be the same building David Axelrod lives in. Do you know David Axelrod? Ever have any interaction with him at all?

Sharon Bialek, Cain accuser: "I saw him in the gym. I mean -- everybody nods to each other. It is friendly building but I never had any interaction with him.""
 

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