Expected number of blue balls drawn from a sack of m red balls and n blue balls?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the expected number of blue balls drawn from a sack containing m red balls and n blue balls when k balls are drawn randomly. The conversation includes mathematical formulations and approaches to derive the expectation.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a summation formula involving combinations to express the expected number of blue balls drawn.
  • Another participant suggests a simpler formula of k*n/(m+n) as a potential answer.
  • A participant expresses a desire to understand the process behind the calculation rather than just the answer.
  • One participant references the expectation of a Hypergeometric variable as relevant to the problem.
  • A later reply proposes using indicator random variables to define the expected value of the total number of blue balls drawn.
  • There is a realization that the answer can be factored out of the summation, indicating a potential simplification in the approach.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants present multiple approaches and formulas, indicating that there is no consensus on a single method or answer. The discussion remains unresolved with competing views on how to derive the expected value.

Contextual Notes

Some mathematical steps and assumptions are not fully resolved, particularly regarding the application of the Hypergeometric distribution and the use of indicator random variables.

Somefantastik
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Can someone help me break this down?

\Sigma^{k}_{i=1}\frac{i \left(^{n}_{i}\right)\left(^{m}_{k-i}\right)}{\left(^{m+n}_{k}\right)}
 
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k*n/(m+n)
 
Thanks for your help, but I had the answer and was really looking for the process.
 
Look at the expectation of a Hypergeometric variable.
 
Somefantastik said:
Can someone help me break this down?

\Sigma^{k}_{i=1}\frac{i \left(^{n}_{i}\right)\left(^{m}_{k-i}\right)}{\left(^{m+n}_{k}\right)}


First translate from math to English: there are m red balls and n blue balls in a sack from which you randomly draw k balls. What is the expected number of blue balls drawn? Now translate back into math: try using indicator random variables X_{j} which equal 1 if the j-th drawn ball is blue and 0 if it is red. Now define the random variable

<br /> X = \sum_{j=1}^{k} X_{j}<br />

and compute the expected value of that and hopefully you'll get the answer that Roberto gave.


addendum: doh! After all that I just realized you can factor the answer out of the sum. Then use the illustration of selecting balls to see what the resulting sum must be.
 
Last edited:

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