I Explaining the Twin Paradox: A Big Problem?

Click For Summary
The discussion centers on the twin paradox, emphasizing that it only arises when twins reunite to compare ages after traveling at different speeds. When two twins move apart and do not meet, relativity indicates there is no definitive answer to which clock is slower, as the situation is symmetrical. The age difference between the twins is explained through the Lorentz transformations and the relativity of simultaneity, which shows that time dilation is frame-dependent. The conversation highlights that comparing elapsed times from different frames does not break symmetry, as each frame has its own perspective on time. Ultimately, the paradox is resolved by understanding that age differences result from the nature of spacetime and not merely from changing frames.
  • #31
In my opinion, the physics is clearer with more convenient numerical values (like the ones given by @Nugatory)
Nugatory said:
These problems are easier to work with if you choose the speed to be either ##\frac{3}{5}c## or ##\frac{4}{5}c## so that the Lorentz factor comes out a nice round fraction: either ##\frac{5}{4}## or ##\frac{5}{3}##. So let's take the speed to ##\frac{3}{5}c## and the distance traveled to be 15 light-years (it's an example so might as well choose numbers that make the arthmetic easy).

Now the journey will take 25 years according to someone on Earth, and if we use the frame in which the Earth is at rest to assign coordinates to the three relevant events in this example:
Event 1, x=0, t=0: Traveller sets out on journey, both clocks are set to zero
Event 2, x=15,t=25: Traveller arrives at destination
Event 3, x=0, t=25: Clock on Earth reads 25

The arithmetic easier when one works with pythagorean triples (like 3,4,5). This occurs when the doppler factor k=\sqrt{\frac{1+v}{1-v}} is rational.
For v=3/5, we have k=2 and \gamma=(k+k^{-1})/2=5/4.
For v=4/5, we have k=3 and \gamma=5/3.
(Alternatively, using rapidities
k=\exp(\mbox{arctanh}(3/5))=2 and \gamma=\cosh(\mbox{arctanh}(3/5))=5/4.)

For \gamma=10, we have
k=\exp(\mbox{arccosh}(10))=(10+3\sqrt{11})=irrational and
v=\tanh(\mbox{arccosh}(10))=(3\sqrt{11}/10) =0.9949 with help from WolframAlpha.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #32
Apart from the equations and calculations, a good way to see what is going on is to draw a spacetime diagram.

Here's the latest version of my spacetime diagrammer (time-upwards)
(version 4) https://www.desmos.com/calculator/kq2qnojphq
(version 6) https://www.desmos.com/calculator/sk2zhnmjmm [new]
1606834297130.png


I use a relative-velocity of (3/5)c above (@Nugatory 's suggested velocity), but I invite to you to adjust the velocities.

The key idea is that "space is perpendicular to time",
a shortened slogan for
"an observer's spaceline is perpendicular to her timeline"
where perpendicularity is defined by the tangency to a "circle" centered at the tail of the displacement (at the origin).

The tangent [space]line of the red observer meets the worldline ( [time]line ) of the green observer
at the event marked by the green cross at (x=0.6,t=1). [You may wish to turn on the grid using the Desmos-wrench in the upper-right corner.]
The displacement to the green cross from the origin is 0.8 of the green radial [time]line segment to the hyperbola. (You can measure this ratio of parallel segments using any ruler.)

As expected by symmetry,
the tangent [space]line of the green observer meets the worldline ( [time]line ) of the red observer at the event marked by the red cross at (x=0,t=0.8).
The displacement to the red cross from the origin is 0.8 of the red radial [time]line segment to the hyperbola. (You can measure this ratio of parallel segments using any ruler.)

This ratio 0.8 is (4/5) = 1/(time dilation factor).
Red says the distant green-cross event occurred 1 tick after the origin.
Green says the local green-cross event occurred 0.8 ticks after the origin.
The time-dilation factor according to Red is
\gamma_{red}=\cosh\theta = (adjacent to local)/(hypotenuse to distant) = (1 tick)/(0.8 ticks) = (5/4).

Green says the distant red-cross event occurred 1 tick after the origin.
Red says the local red-cross event occurred 0.8 ticks after the origin.
The time-dilation factor according to Green is
\gamma_{green}=\cosh\theta = (adjacent to local)/(hypotenuse to distant) = (1 tick)/(0.8 ticks) = (5/4).

Adjust the v2-slider to see that this ratio is common to both observers.
(These are similar-triangles where similarity is defined by the "circle".)
Although I limit the range of the velocities to 0.98c,
you can type in 0.995 to override it. [You could also put "\tanh\left(\operatorname{arccosh}\left(10\right)\right) "]
(You might have to zoom out to see the tip of the green-tick.)
(To get more decimal places, open the "time dilation" folder and change the number of digits in round().)

Back to v1=0 and v2=0.6,
you can drag the event on the green worldline to the green-cross event
to determine the event on the red-worldline that green says is simultaneous with the green-cross event.

(To make the arithmetic simpler, you can drag the events controlling the spacelines to 5 ticks.)

You might wish to adjust the E-slider from "1" for Minkowski-spacetime
to "0" for Galilean-spacetime and "-1" for Euclidean space.

You can also adjust both v1 and v2.

Have fun.
 
Last edited:
  • Informative
  • Like
Likes Dale and etotheipi
  • #33
Last edited:
  • #34
Hello,

Once again thank you to all the participants, you helped me to see things more clearly.

@PeroK: your explanations are very clear. I just read Einstein synchronization convention and I understand where my error is coming from.

@A.T. : Ok, I misunderstood you. I understand better why Einstein used the famous wagons with their ends A and B, and respectively A'and B'.

@Halc: Thank you for this quantified demonstration. I haven't checked your calculation yet but I will, and I'm sure it's right. This will allow me to strengthen my understanding.

@robphy: Thank you for your detailed explanations and your patience !
Your software is great !
I'll use it !

Honestly, I must admit that I learn a lot more things here than on the French speaking forums.
I will recommend your site!Marilyn
 
  • Like
Likes A.T., Halc, Dale and 1 other person

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 35 ·
2
Replies
35
Views
3K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 254 ·
9
Replies
254
Views
19K
  • · Replies 24 ·
Replies
24
Views
4K
  • · Replies 24 ·
Replies
24
Views
2K
  • · Replies 115 ·
4
Replies
115
Views
8K
  • · Replies 70 ·
3
Replies
70
Views
6K