Extra Killing Vector Field in Kerr Spacetime?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the existence of an additional Killing vector field (KVF) in Kerr spacetime, particularly in the context of the "no hair" theorem for black holes. Participants explore the implications of Hawking's work on the rigidity conjecture and the organization of Killing fields in relation to the event horizon.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants reference the "no hair" theorem and its assumptions regarding axial symmetry, noting that Hawking's removal of this assumption introduces complications.
  • One participant highlights a specific statement from a paper indicating that there exists an additional KVF tangent to the horizon's generators, seeking clarification on its meaning.
  • Another participant acknowledges their unfamiliarity with the concept but provides links to related literature that may be relevant.
  • A participant explains their understanding of the relationship between the stationary KVF and the additional null KVF, suggesting a different organizational perspective on these fields.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about their prior knowledge of the topic, indicating that they may have encountered it before but do not recall the details.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the implications of Hawking's findings or the specific nature of the additional KVF. Multiple interpretations and understandings of the Killing fields are presented, indicating ongoing debate and exploration of the topic.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of the topic, including assumptions about the spacetime structure and the mathematical implications of the findings. There is an acknowledgment of the need for further clarification on the relationship between different KVFs.

Messages
49,892
Reaction score
25,936
In a recent thread, the following was posted regarding the "no hair" theorem for black holes:

martinbn said:
Carter and Robinson proved it assuming that the space-time has axial symmetry. Hawking removed that assumption, but had an analyticity, assumption which is unreasonable both mathematically and physically. The problem is still open. In the mathematical literature it is known as the rigidity conjecture.

www.ihes.fr/~vanhove/Slides/Klainerman-ihes-fev2011.pdf

https://arxiv.org/pdf/1501.01587

In the arxiv paper linked to, it says the following (p. 2, after Theorem 1.1):

"Hawking has shown that in addition to the original, stationary, Killing field, which has to be tangent to the event horizon, there must exist, infinitesimally along the horizon and tangent to its generators, an additional Killing vector-field."

This is the first I've heard of this, and it's not elaborated on in the paper. Can anyone explain what this refers to?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
PeterDonis said:
"Hawking has shown that in addition to the original, stationary, Killing field, which has to be tangent to the event horizon, there must exist, infinitesimally along the horizon and tangent to its generators, an additional Killing vector-field."

This is the first I've heard of this, and it's not elaborated on in the paper. Can anyone explain what this refers to?

Either I have forgotten completely about this, or I also have never heard about it. Page 323 (attached) of 'General Relativity' by Wald also mentions the result. In particular, see the sentence that starts "Finally, in case (iii) ..."
 

Attachments

George Jones said:
see the sentence that starts "Finally, in case (iii) ..."

Ah, I get it. It's just a different way of organizing the Killing fields. The way I usually think of them is that we have the stationary KVF ##\xi^a##, which is timelike at infinity, and the axial KVF ##\psi^a##, which has closed orbits. But ##\xi^a## is spacelike on the horizon (it's null at the static limit, not the horizon), and the horizon has to be generated by null geodesics, so there is also a null KVF ##\chi^a## that is tangent to the horizon generators. In my usual way of thinking of these, we have ##\chi^a = \xi^a + \Omega \psi^a##, where ##\Omega## is the "angular velocity of the horizon". But Hawking's proof can be viewed as starting with ##\xi^a## (whose existence follows from the spacetime being stationary), proving the existence of ##\chi^a## (i.e., of a KVF linearly independent of ##\xi^a## that is null on the horizon), and then using those two to construct ##\psi^a## (i.e., proving that the spacetime is axially symmetric).
 
George Jones said:
Either I have forgotten completely about this, or I also have never heard about it.

Since I've read Wald before, I evidently had seen it before, but had forgotten. :eek:
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
22
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
4K
  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
3K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
6K