Find the smallest possible value of abc + def + ghi

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the smallest possible value of the expression abc + def + ghi, where a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i are permutations of the digits 1 through 9. The conversation explores various interpretations, calculations, and mathematical inequalities related to this problem.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants clarify that abc, def, and ghi represent products of three numbers, not concatenated digits.
  • One participant suggests an empirical solution yielding a value of 216, but acknowledges the need to prove that no other combination yields a lower sum.
  • Another participant claims to have found a smaller value of 214, but does not provide a detailed explanation initially.
  • A later post references the AM-GM inequality to argue that the minimum value of abc + def + ghi is at least 214, providing a mathematical justification for this claim.
  • Participants discuss potential combinations of the digits that could achieve the minimum value, with one suggesting that abc = 72, def = 72, and ghi = 70 leads to a total of 214.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

There is no consensus on the smallest possible value, as participants propose different values (216 and 214) and methods to reach their conclusions. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the absolute minimum.

Contextual Notes

Participants rely on various mathematical principles, including the AM-GM inequality, but the application and implications of these principles are not universally agreed upon. There are also mentions of potential errors in earlier posts, indicating uncertainty in the calculations.

anemone
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Let a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i be a permutation of (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9).

Find the smallest possible value of abc + def + ghi.
 
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anemone said:
Let a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i be a permutation of (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9).

Find the smallest possible value of abc + def + ghi.

Is that a product or concatenating digits? E.g. if a = 2, b = 3, c = 5 is abc equal to 30 or 235? Just making sure.
 
Bacterius said:
Is that a product or concatenating digits? E.g. if a = 2, b = 3, c = 5 is abc equal to 30 or 235? Just making sure.

I'm sorry I wasn't clear on that part...:o

abc, def and ghi are all products of three numbers.
 
anemone said:
I'm sorry I wasn't clear on that part...:o

abc, def and ghi are all products of three numbers.

Well normally it would be clear you meant a product but since the variables were between 1 and 9 it was at least conceivable you could have meant something else. All good now though, and an interesting puzzle :p
 
anemone said:
Let a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i be a permutation of (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9).

Find the smallest possible value of abc + def + ghi.

Empirically it seems to be $8 \cdot 9 \cdot 1 + 6 \cdot 7 \cdot 2 + 3 \cdot 4 \cdot 5 = 216$... but of course we have to demonstrate that any other sum is greater than 216...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
Empirically it seems to be $8 \cdot 9 \cdot 1 + 6 \cdot 7 \cdot 2 + 3 \cdot 4 \cdot 5 = 216$... but of course we have to demonstrate that any other sum is greater than 216...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$

Hmm...the smallest value that I've gotten is 214...
 
anemone said:
Let a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i be a permutation of (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9).

Find the smallest possible value of abc + def + ghi.
If the natural generalization of the rearrangement inequality holds (see Rearrangement inequality - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) then the answer seems to be 216.

EDIT: I made a mistake. Please ignore this post.
 
anemone said:
Let a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, i be a permutation of (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9).

Find the smallest possible value of abc + def + ghi.

I should have said the answer that I've found by taking a peek into the work of other is 214 and that I didn't solve this question on my own.

In the solution that I'm referring to, the idea of AM-GM inequality was used to get 214 as the lowest possible value for abc+def+ghi.

For starters, AM-GM inequality states that

$$\frac{abc+def+ghi}{3} \ge \sqrt[3]{abc\cdot def \cdot def}$$

$$ abc+def+ghi \ge 3\cdot\sqrt[3]{9!}$$

$$\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\ge 213.98$$

$$\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\;\; \ge 214$$

He then guessed the minimum of the sum of abc, def and ghi is achieved when they're near 70 and 72 because $$\frac{214}{3}\approx 71.333$$.

By some guesswork we see that

$$abc=9\cdot8\cdot1=72$$

$$def=3\cdot4\cdot6=72$$

$$gjo=2\cdot5\cdot7=70$$

Hence, the smallest possible value of abc+def+ghi=72+72+70=214, which agrees with the result that we found from AM-GM inequality.
 

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