Force on Steel Bar Inside Solenoid

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion focuses on calculating the force acting on a steel bar inside a solenoid, specifically for a coil cannon project. Participants mention the magnetic field inside the solenoid, described by the equation B = μNi, and express a need for deriving the force on the steel bar under this magnetic field. They also touch on the dynamics of the bar's motion, suggesting harmonic oscillation and the influence of varying current from a capacitor bank. Safety concerns are raised regarding the energy levels involved in the project.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of solenoid physics and magnetic fields
  • Familiarity with the equation B = μNi for magnetic field strength
  • Basic knowledge of harmonic oscillation principles
  • Experience with capacitor banks and their energy storage capabilities
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the derivation of the force on a ferromagnetic material in a magnetic field
  • Learn about the dynamics of oscillating systems in electromagnetism
  • Study the effects of varying current on solenoid performance
  • Explore safety protocols for high-energy capacitor bank experiments
USEFUL FOR

Physics students, hobbyists building electromagnetic devices, and anyone interested in the principles of electromagnetism and safety in high-energy experiments.

abilolado
Messages
23
Reaction score
7
Hello all.
Me and some friends are building a coil cannon, and we've been doing some calculations [I know its unecessary but... well, we're physicists! (well, physics students...)]. But we got stuck.
How to calculate the force acting on a steel bar (or some other ferromagnetic material, maybe there's a constant related to each type of material for this application) of length L_{bar} and radius R_{bar} inside a solenoid of N turns with current i flowing through it (R_{bar}<R_{solenoid})?
I found approximations that the magnetic field inside the solenoid is B=\mu N i (using the right hand rule to find the direction, no problem there). I don't know, however, how to get the force applied on a steel bar under this field. Even an approximation would be great (But exact solutions are very appreciated, even more if they have the whole process of deriving the equation, hehe).
From the demonstrations online, I see that the bar oscillates going in and out of the coil. So I'm guessing there's some sort of harmonic oscillation approximation.
Much like shown in this clip (2:13):



(Unless the damping comes from something other then friction, there's no need to include it)

PS: Since we're using a capacitor bank, the current will not be constant, but I guess I can integrate the approximation over a varying current anyway.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
How big is your capacitor bank? What size projectile, and with what planned exit velocity?
 
berkeman said:
How big is your capacitor bank? What size projectile, and with what planned exit velocity?
Everything is arbitrary for now.
 
abilolado said:
Everything is arbitrary for now.
Whelp, if you are hoping to work with many kJ of capacitively stored energy and fire medium size projectiles at many meters per second, this thread will be closed as dangerous. If you are looking to make a small table-top demonstration with 12V capacitive storage of a little bit of energy, that may be okay.

BTW, I didn't watch the video. Solenoids work by pulling ferrous metal bars into the coil. How do you make an ejector mechanism out of that?
 
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the meaning of a solenoid. The whole point is to have the projectile, or whatever it is, being accelerated due to the magnetic field produced by the current in a looped wire. The current would be cut off once the projectile reached the middle of the coil so that there be no force pulling it back in, like in the video.
I just need to know the equations describing the forces or the displacement so we can make predictions about the final velocity.
We're just a physics club under the supervision of the university, there's not much we can to do make it dangerous in any way.
 
abilolado said:
We're just a physics club under the supervision of the university,

And nobody at this university can help you with these calculations? How is this "supervision"?

abilolado said:
there's not much we can to do make it dangerous in any way.

That's absurd. "We don't know what we are doing so we can't make it dangerous" is simply untrue.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
4K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
874
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
1K