Fuel Cell System: ET1 & EST1 Designs

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around two proposed designs for a fuel cell system: the ET1, which integrates a turbine and electrolysis, and the EST1, which incorporates a Stirling engine and a thermal room. The focus is on the theoretical and practical aspects of these designs, including their components and functionality.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes the ET1 design, which uses the water vapor exhaust from a PEM fuel cell to run a turbine that generates electricity, which is then used to power the car's engine and facilitate electrolysis to produce more hydrogen.
  • The same participant outlines the EST1 design, emphasizing the use of a thermal room to capture waste heat from the fuel cell to power a Stirling engine, which in turn generates electricity for electrolysis.
  • Another participant requests clarification on how the thermal room operates, specifically how it traps and utilizes waste heat from the fuel cell.
  • A further response explains that the thermal room conducts heat from the fuel cell and can also store water vapor, contributing to the Stirling engine's operation.
  • Concerns are raised about the feasibility of generating sufficient steam to power the turbine in the ET1 design, prompting a question about the size and capacity of the PEM fuel cell being used.
  • The original poster responds that they are using a 50KW PEM fuel cell unit, which is typical for automotive applications, and notes that the turbine is designed to be small but sufficient to generate additional electricity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of confidence in the designs, with some questioning the practicality of generating enough steam for the turbine in the ET1 system. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the effectiveness and efficiency of the proposed systems.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the need for empirical testing to validate the designs, as well as potential dependencies on specific materials and configurations for the thermal room and Stirling engine.

The P-manator
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Here are the descriptions of two of my designs.

ET1: Turbine and Electrolysis System

The Turbine:
I have used the water vapour exhaust of a PEM fuel cell to run a turbine to make electricity. After the water vapour has passed through the turbine it goes to electrolysis system. The electricity produced is used with the electricity already made by the fuel cell to power the engine of the car.

The Electrolysis:
Here I use part of the electricity from the turbine to run the electrolysis of the water vapour; creating more hydrogen to get used up by the fuel cell.

Conclusion:
This is basically a self-generating system where the pieces of the jigsaw puzzle all fit nicely together (hopefully). The point of this system is to really make the most electricity possible while being practical.

EST1: Electrolysis, Stirling Engine, and Thermal Room System

The Thermal Room:
This is an invention made by myself. It is a room which traps the heat from the fuel cell to use it in various ways. It is made of a high-temperature-resistant insulator that will not melt at the temperatures it is insulating.

The Stirling Engine:
In this case the thermal room is heating part of Stirling engine. This Stirling engine turns electromagnets to make electricity, which is used in part to power electrolysis (or it can be used fully for that purpose).

The Electrolysis:
The electrolysis in this system is the same as in the ET1 system, although a catalyst would be used here.

Conclusion:
Here I make use of the heat that is just usually wasted in PEM fuel cells to make even more electricity. The success of this system, however, would depend on the catalyst to speed up the electrolysis.
 
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The P-manator said:
The Thermal Room:
This is an invention made by myself. It is a room which traps the heat from the fuel cell to use it in various ways. It is made of a high-temperature-resistant insulator that will not melt at the temperatures it is insulating.

Can you describe how it works?
 
OK, well basically it traps the waste heat from the fuel cell and keeps it hot. Then that heat makes the Stirling engine work. The heat is conducted from the fuel cell out through a vent where it is taken by the thermal room. There can also be storage of water vapour inside the thermal room.
 
The P-manator said:
The Turbine:
I have used the water vapour exhaust of a PEM fuel cell to run a turbine to make electricity.
You really are producing enough steam fast enough to turn a turbine and generate electricity? How many cells and how large is your PEM fuel cell?
 
I am using a 50KW unit that would likely be used in cars as a model. The turbine won't be very big, but just enough to produce some extra electricity. Tests are still to come.
 

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