Heavier object has higher inertia

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    Inertia
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of inertia, particularly in the context of a car accelerating and the effects on the driver. Participants explore the relationship between mass, inertia, and motion, examining why a heavier object (the car) moves while a lighter object (the driver) appears to resist motion during acceleration.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that inertia is the tendency of an object to resist changes in its state of motion, with heavier objects having higher inertia.
  • One participant questions why the heavier car moves while the driver, who has lower mass, tends to remain at rest, suggesting that the car's connection to its engine allows it to overcome its inertia.
  • Another participant references Newton's laws of motion to explain the interaction between the driver and the car during acceleration, emphasizing the role of external forces.
  • Some participants express dissatisfaction with the term "inertia," arguing that it can be ambiguous, sometimes referring to mass and other times to linear momentum.
  • A participant illustrates the concept of inertia by comparing the driver's experience to that of a water bottle on a passenger seat during sudden braking, highlighting the independent motion of the driver’s torso.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the definition and implications of inertia, with some expressing differing views on its meaning and application in the context of the car and driver scenario.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved issues regarding the definitions of inertia, mass, and momentum, as well as the implications of these terms in practical scenarios. The discussion reflects varying interpretations of how these concepts apply to the situation described.

sallychan
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I learn that inertia means the tendency an object will remain from changes. Heavier object has higher inertia, which means higher tendency to resist change.

So, here is an example from my teacher.
A car accelerates, the driver is pulled backward and hit the rear of his seat. This is due to inertia of the driver-- he tends to remain in rest rather than accelerating.

My problem is, the car is definitely heavier than the driver, which means the car should have higher inertia than the driver. Why the car moves, but the driver tends to remain in rest?
 
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sallychan said:
the car is definitely heavier than the driver, which means the car should have higher inertia than the driver
That's why the ground applies more force to the car, than the car to the driver.

sallychan said:
Why the car moves, but the driver tends to remain in rest?
Both accelerate, when a force is applied. The car requires more force for the same acceleration.
 
Newton's First Law of Motion: An object at rest tends to remain at rest unless acted upon by an external force.

When the car starts to accelerate, the driver's body wants to remain stationary, if but for a moment. When the driver's body is pushed back into the seat, the seat is also pushing back on the driver's body. This is where Newton's Third Law applies: For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. After this, Newton's Second Law applies (F = ma) until the car and driver have accelerated and reached a constant speed.
 
sallychan said:
My problem is, the car is definitely heavier than the driver, which means the car should have higher inertia than the driver. Why the car moves, but the driver tends to remain in rest?
The car is securely bolted to its engine and wheels, so whatever the powerful engine dictates, the rest of the car follows along. (I described the engine as "powerful"; it needs to be powerful to overcome the enormous inertia of the heavy car body and engine.) The man's head is only loosely positioned on his body, and in most sitting positions the driver's head is not supported against the head rest. So in effect, his head is just flopping about in mid-air. The head rest is really a safety feature, so that if the car is rear-ended the driver's head is not flung back so far (due to inertia) as to cause neck damage.
 
sallychan said:
I learn that inertia means the tendency an object will remain from changes. Heavier object has higher inertia, which means higher tendency to resist change.

So, here is an example from my teacher.
A car accelerates, the driver is pulled backward and hit the rear of his seat. This is due to inertia of the driver-- he tends to remain in rest rather than accelerating.
This exemplifies why I don't like the term "inertia". It's an ambiguous term that sometimes means mass, other times linear momentum. In this one example it is used in both contexts.

I'm not alone in my dislike. Once one progresses beyond the introductory calculus-based physics class you just won't see that word used with one exception, "moment of inertia" or "(moment of) inertia tensor".

There are two perfectly good and unambiguous phrases that mean mass and linear momentum, respectively. They are of course mass and linear momentum.
 
D H said:
This exemplifies why I don't like the term "inertia". It's an ambiguous term that sometimes means mass, other times linear momentum. In this one example it is used in both contexts.
I see only the mass context.
 
All macroscopic objects will maintain their velocity unless acted upon by an outside source. In the case of the car driver and the car, the car driver's torso isn't bolted to his seat. It is free to move independently from the car, so he will maintain his velocity as the car accelerates around him. You can understand this concept better if you put a water bottle on your passenger seat and slam on the brakes. The water bottle will go flying forward due to its inertia. This is the exact same phenomenon as the driver falling back in his seat during acceleration.
 

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