Help with Understanding Governing Equations of CFD

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter m.gos
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Cfd
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the governing equations of computational fluid dynamics (CFD), particularly focusing on the continuity equation and the Reynolds-averaged Navier-Stokes equations. Participants seek clarification on the mathematical expressions and their physical interpretations, emphasizing the need for examples to aid comprehension.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses difficulty in understanding the difference between the operations \nabla \bullet V and V \bullet \nabla, seeking a semi-technical explanation.
  • Another participant clarifies that \nabla \bullet V represents the spatial variation of the velocity field, while V \bullet \nabla is used with a function to show the spatial variation of that function.
  • Definitions of various symbols relevant to the equations are provided, including concentration, diffusion coefficient, reaction rate, velocity vector, density, and heat sources.
  • A participant attempts to interpret the continuity equation, suggesting it describes the relationship between the time rate of change of density and mass flow in a fluid element.
  • There is a mention of the operator D, which tracks changes in a quantity of interest as a fluid parcel moves, although its application in the context of transport phenomena is noted to be complex.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the definitions and interpretations of the symbols and equations discussed, but the understanding of the equations and their implications remains nuanced and unresolved, with some participants seeking further clarification.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the context of the equations and the specific applications in fluid dynamics may not be fully articulated, leading to potential gaps in understanding. The discussion also reflects varying backgrounds of participants, which may influence their interpretations.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students or professionals in engineering, particularly those focused on chemical engineering or fluid dynamics, who are seeking to deepen their understanding of CFD governing equations.

m.gos
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
I need some help in understanding some of the governing equations of computational fluid dynamics. I already have some books to read, others are on their way, yet I still find it difficult because I learn much better on examples rather than pure theory. I was hoping someone could 'read out' for me the equations below in a semi-mathematician semi-fluid-dynamicist manner, if you know what I mean.
For instance I know what [tex]\nabla[/tex] is (in cartesian coordinates), but I still have not figured out how does [tex]\nabla\bullet[/tex]V (V is vector velocity field in cartesian space) differ from V[tex]\bullet\nabla[/tex]. I also know local derivatives, substantial derivatives (tota derivative with respect to time), but when it comes to reading equations with understanding I get confused.
First set of equations refers to mass transfer (continuity equation) and is as follows:
http://img855.imageshack.us/i/chds.png/
Second set of equations refers to RENS (Raynolds-averaged Navier-Stokes) k-e turbulance model, so a bit more complicated:
http://img846.imageshack.us/i/nitf.png/Thank you in advance,
Mat
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Hello, m.gos and welcome to PF. Heady stuff !

First the difference between v dot nabla and nabla dot v.

In the following I have replaced v with [tex]\nu[/tex] to avoid confusion with their components.

Let [tex]\nu[/tex] be the velocity with components u, v, w. relative to the x, y, z axes.

Let there also be a function f(x,y,z) of some quantity of interest (eg density) with respect to these same axes

[tex]\nu[/tex] dot nabla is used with a function to display the spatial variation of that function.

nabla dot [tex]\nu[/tex] is the spatial variation of the velocity itself.

Specifically, when written out in full.

[tex]\nu .\nabla f = u\frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial x}} + v\frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial y}} + w\frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial z}}[/tex]

It can be seen that nabla is really operating on f to create a vector which is then dot (pre)multiplied by [tex]\nu[/tex]

and

[tex]\nabla .\nu = \frac{{\partial u}}{{\partial x}} + \frac{{\partial v}}{{\partial y}} + \frac{{\partial w}}{{\partial z}}[/tex]

I note in your attachments you refer to D which is a function peculiar to fluid dynamics. D refers to the rate of change 'following the fluid'. That is it tracks some quantity of interest of a particular parcel of fluid as it moves from point to point.
Use of D normally involves introducing time, which I have not done above for simplicity.

Does this help?
 
Last edited:
Thanks a lot Studiot.

Even though you focused on my first question you gave to it the precise answer I needed. Looks very sensible once you know it. Also thanks for the symbol explenation.
I think I should also give some more comment regarding the second part of my post where I ask how to read the equations from the two links. First of all here are some symbols definitions:

• c is the concentration of the species (mol/m3)
• D denotes the diffusion coefficient (m2/s)
• R is a reaction rate expression for the species (mol/(m3·s))
• u is the velocity vector (m/s)
• R is a reaction rate expression for the species (mol/(m3·s))
• N is an arbitrary user-specified flux expression (SI unit: mol/(m2·s)).
• [tex]\rho[/tex] is the density (SI unit: kg/m3)
• Q contains heat sources other than viscous heating (SI unit: W/m3)
• T is absolute temperature (SI unit: K)

All I really need are the first two equataions from each set, I am sure this will be enough for me to do the rest myself. Now, to show what I am after I will give it a try with the 2nd equation from the second set:
The equation is a partial differential form of the continuity (mass conservation) equation. It states that for the considered element of fluid the sum of the time rate of change of density at the fixed point in space (local derivative) and the time rate of change of (mass flow?) equals zero. Does it make sense? Can someone do a similar thing with other 3 equations?

Cheers
 
Well I didn't realize you were coming from a chem eng direction.

Fluids books seem to cost extra - an arm and a leg, but Chem eng books always cost yet more - two arms and two legs - you have my sympathies.

Since this is about transport phenomenona, my comment about D was misplaced. Thanks you for the key to the symbols - makes life a deal easier.

My D is really an operator and used thus:

[tex]\frac{{Df}}{{Dt}} = \frac{d}{{dt}}f\left\{ {x\left( t \right),y\left( t \right),z\left( t \right),t,} \right\} = \frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial x}}\frac{{dx}}{{dt}} + \frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial y}}\frac{{dy}}{{dt}} + \frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial x}}\frac{{dz}}{{dz}} + \frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial t}}[/tex]

[tex]= \frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial t}} + u\frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial x}} + v\frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial y}} + w\frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial x}}[/tex]

[tex]= \frac{{\partial f}}{{\partial t}} + \nu .\nabla f[/tex]

Which was one of your original enquiries.

If no one has helped further I will try to look tomorrow, but it is after midnight here.

go well
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
4K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
1K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
1K