How can I graph the pressure behind a dam after a bomb explosion?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around how to graph the pressure behind a dam following a bomb explosion. Participants explore the effects of the explosion at a specific depth and how it interacts with the water pressure acting on the dam. The conversation touches on theoretical and practical aspects of pressure calculations in civil engineering contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks assistance in understanding how to graph the pressure behind the dam, given specific dimensions and conditions related to the bomb explosion.
  • Another participant questions the interpretation of the pressure created by the bomb, suggesting it may be superimposed on the water pressure and dependent on the explosion's distance from the dam.
  • There is a discussion about the formula for pressure, with one participant noting that pressure is defined as force per unit area, but the complexity of shock waves from an explosion complicates this relationship.
  • One participant proposes using the equation for pressure due to water, incorporating water density, gravity, and depth, but raises questions about the relevance of the dam's protruding height and thickness.
  • Clarifications are sought regarding the nature of the graph, specifically what variables are being plotted against pressure and how the explosion's pressure varies across different areas of the dam.
  • A later reply reiterates the dimensions of the dam and the specifics of the bomb explosion, suggesting that the graph should illustrate how pressure increases with depth, starting from zero at the top of the dam.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on how to interpret the pressure from the bomb explosion and its interaction with water pressure. There is no consensus on the exact method for graphing the pressure or the implications of the dam's dimensions on the calculations.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the need for clarity regarding the assumptions made about the bomb's pressure distribution and the effects of the dam's structure on pressure calculations. There are unresolved questions about the relationship between the explosion's pressure and the water pressure at varying depths.

qubert
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m studying civil engineering and trying to research how a bomb would affect a dam, but i know little about physics so could anyone help with this problem?

dam has dimensions 7.6m wide at the top, 39.6m wide at the bottom and 34m tall, water level is 2m from top of the dam.

135*10^6 cubic metres of water behind dam

bomb explodes at a depth of 9m and creates a pressure of 100kN/m^2 over the back of the dam in addition to the water,

how would i draw a graph to represent the pressure behind the dam?

many thanks..
 
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Hi qubert,
Do you know how to find pressure on the dam as a function of depth?
... bomb explodes at a depth of 9m and creates a pressure of 100kN/m^2 over the back of the dam in addition to the water,
From the way this is worded, I read this to mean only that the bomb creates a pressure of 100 kN/m^2 over the entire face of the damn (all over). Unless there is some additional information (such as how far away from the dam the bomb explodes and the pressure is 100 kN/m^2 at some given radius) then I think we have to assume the pressure is superimposed on top of the pressure you find as a function of depth.
 
is it just force*area?
 
qubert said:
is it just force*area?

actually.. it's Force/Area.. but the thing here is more complicated than that. For an explosion, the damaging 'shock waves' generally travel via compressions and rarefactions in the air accompanied by shrapnel. The thing is that when you use the formula Force/Area, you can directly substitute variables only if the Force is uniform over the complete area, which in our case is not because the shockwaves travel radially outwards (as a generalization) and hence depending on where the bomb exploded.. the force will be different at different areas and hence the pressure. So, for your case, pressure is rather the derivative of force with respect to area:

[tex] P = \frac{dF}{dA}[/tex]
 
so to create this graph i would use this equation to find the pressure of 100kn and at each 1m and add the pressure of the water using pressure=water density*gravity*depth?, would it make any difference to the 2m of the dam protruding out of the water or the changing thickness of the dam? thanks
 
qubert said:
so to create this graph i would use this equation to find the pressure of 100kn and at each 1m and add the pressure of the water using pressure=water density*gravity*depth?, would it make any difference to the 2m of the dam protruding out of the water or the changing thickness of the dam? thanks

[tex] P = \rho_w mgh[/tex]

is the pressure for a surface when gravity acts parallel to the application of force to it. You need the pressure for the wall of a dam, where gravity is perpendicular to the wall.

Also, a graph is drawn between two variables to show how they vary with each other. I'm not at all clear which graph you are talking about when you say that you want to 'draw a graph of pressure'. It has to be Pressure vs. something.

Can you please be clear on '2m of the dam protruding out of the water'. Changing the thickness of the dam walls will increase the yield strength. However it needs to be done keeping elastic properties in mind else despite an increase yield strength, the ability of the walls to withstand the shockwave will decrease.

Also, 'pressure of 100 kN/m^2' doesn't mean anything because as i said.. in the case of a bomb the pressure in bomb is not constant at a given area. It is different at different areas.

If you are dealing with a word problem from a textbook or something.. it'd be helpful if you quote the entire problem.
 
Theb bouncing bomb was designed to explode at a depth of 9m below the surface. The dam itself, had the dimensions shown below.

7.6m wide at top
39.6m wide at bottom
34m height
135x10^6m^3 of water behind dam
bomb sinks and explodes against wall at 9m depth

If the explosion developed a pressure of 100 kN/m2 over the back of the Dam in addition to the pressure from the water; draw a graph of the pressure behind the dam if the distance from water surface to top of dam is 2m. (Assume back of Dam to be vertical).

is the problem, thanks

i think by draw a graph it just means plot how the the pressure increases with depth? starting with 0 when the dam is out of the water getting higher with water pressure + the explosion?
 

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