How is the effective Lagrangian for the Graviton coupling to matter derived?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of the effective Lagrangian for the graviton coupling to matter, specifically the expression L = (1/M_pl) h^{μν} T_{μν}. Participants explore theoretical frameworks and references related to this topic, including classical and quantum mechanical approaches.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant requests guidance on the derivation of the effective Lagrangian for graviton coupling to matter.
  • Another participant references literature, specifically mentioning Zee's "Quantum Field Theory," which discusses the coupling of gravity to matter in the weak field approximation.
  • A participant expresses confusion regarding the definition of the stress-energy tensor and perceives the explanation as circular logic.
  • One participant argues that the circularity is a fundamental aspect of how scientific theories are validated against experimental observations.
  • Another participant clarifies that the relationship between the stress-energy tensor and the action can be expressed in two equivalent forms, emphasizing their linear relationship.
  • A later reply introduces a formal approach to proving the coupling through the BRST antibracket-antifield formalism, providing a reference to a specific paper.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit differing views on the nature of the definitions and relationships involved in the derivation, with some perceiving circular logic while others defend the definitions as valid. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the clarity of these concepts.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight potential limitations in understanding due to the definitions used and the assumptions inherent in the weak field approximation.

Karatechop250
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Could someone point to me where they derive the follow effective Lagrangian for the Graviton coupling to matter

L = \frac{1}{M_{pl{}}}h^{\mu \nu}T_{\mu \nu}
 
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A great many books discuss the coupling of gravity to matter in the framework of the classical weak field approximation. One ref that does it QM-ically is Quantum Field Theory by Zee, Sect VIII, "Gravity and Beyond".

The fundamental definition Tμν = - (2/√-g) δSM/δgμν tells us that coupling of the graviton to matter (in the weak field limit) can be included by adding the term - ∫d4x ½hμν Tμν to the action...
 
Thanks, however this just seems as circular logic to me and confuses me cause we defined the stress energy tensor that way. I will read this book though.
 
Last edited:
Since physics is an experimental science, ultimately the answer is "so that our calculations match what we see". This may sound circular, but it's how (and why) science works.
 
It's not circular logic, it's just two ways of writing the same thing. Do you want to say T = δS/δg, or do you want to say δS = T δg?

More explicitly, the first form is Tμν = (2/√-g) δSM/δgμν

while the second form is δSM = ½∫d4x √-g Tμν δgμν

They both say that when you subject gμν to an infinitesimal variation, the change in the action is linear in δgμν, and the coefficient is defined to be Tμν.
 

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