How magnets attract objects mechanically?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the mechanisms and physical principles behind how magnets attract objects at a distance. Participants explore various explanations, including field theory and the nature of electromagnetic interactions, while seeking a more intuitive understanding of the phenomenon.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the need for a physical medium in magnetic attraction, comparing it to how electric charges interact at a distance.
  • Another participant suggests that magnetic fields interact similarly to gravitational fields, where the effects are observable but the fields themselves are not directly visible.
  • A claim is made that light is responsible for magnetic and electrostatic interactions, though this is contested by others who argue that light is merely a disturbance in the electromagnetic field.
  • Some participants discuss the concept of electromagnetic waves and fields, suggesting that a mechanical explanation may not be suitable for understanding these phenomena.
  • One participant mentions that iron provides a shorter path for magnetic field lines, indicating a relationship between field lines and energy, while acknowledging that this explanation raises further questions related to Maxwell's Equations.
  • References to Dr. Feynman's insights are made, with differing opinions on whether his explanations adequately address the original question posed.
  • A participant introduces the concept of "Aether" as a potential medium, speculating on the nature of free space and its magnetic properties.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the nature of magnetic attraction, with no consensus reached. Some agree on the role of fields, while others dispute the explanations involving light and mechanical interpretations.

Contextual Notes

Some claims rely on assumptions about the nature of fields and interactions, and there are unresolved questions regarding the relationship between field lines and energy, as well as the implications of Maxwell's Equations.

dejesusluisx1
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I've seen many technical explanations relating field theory, but haven't seen an explanation to this date that can clearly explain how magnets attract at a distance. What is the physical medium used to attract and what is the mechanism? Please no elevated technical talk, and no references to books, explain it as if you were seeing it with your naked eyes!
 
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welcome to pf!

hi dejesusluisx1! welcome to pf! :smile:

the explanation is the same as how electric charges can attract (or repel) each other desipte being at a distance …

if you're happy with that, what is your objection in the case of magnetism? :confused:
 
What is the physical medium used to attract and what is the mechanism?

There is no physical medium necessary...no more than sunlight needs a 'medium' to propagate through space. the electric and magnetic field are two closely related entities found in every electromagnetic field...what you observe depends on your relative motion with respect to the field. Sit still with a magnet, you observe a magnetic field; move and it becomes an electric field.
 
My textbook asked us an equivalent question phrased as: "how does one object "know" of the presence of another object that it would attract/repel?"

And the answer is the interaction of their magnetic fields. All magnetic objects "set up" a vector field around them. It's not something we can see in and of itself, we can only observe its effects. It's a bit like gravity in that way - we can't "see" gravity, we see its effects.
 
Light is the physical phenomenon responsible for magnetic and electrostatic attraction and repulsion. Light carries momentum from one charged body to another, the direction depends on the sign of the charge. Magnetism is the consequence of relativistic motion (in familiar cases rotational or revolutionary motion) of electric charges.
 
Greg-ulate said:
Light is the physical phenomenon responsible for magnetic and electrostatic attraction and repulsion. .
I don't think this is true. There is no light between objects or particles atracting electricaly or magneticaly. Light is just the disturbance of the electrmagnetic field.
Maybe you are talking about QED model, where interaction is explained by exchange of virtual photons, but they are not light.
 
xAxis said:
I don't think this is true. There is no light between objects or particles atracting electricaly or magneticaly. Light is just the disturbance of the electrmagnetic field.

He means Electromagnetic Waves / Fields. Light is a subset of these.
It is asking too much, I'm afraid, to ask for a "Mechanical" explanation of something that just isn't mechanical. We are supposed to be advancing in our understanding of Physics and, consequently, there will be ideas that don't fit in with the old views. Insisting on an easy explanation of Physical phenomena is just debasing the whole Subject.
 
Dr. Feynman was asked the same question. His answer will give you great insight and it is very simple to understand.
 
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Iron is a shorter path for the magnetic field lines then air. It is the nature of magnetic field lines to be as short as possible. The shortest possible path with the highest density of lines is with the iron as close as possible to the magnet. If they are free to move, the magnet and iron, will seek this lowest energy state, that is the shortest possible field lines.

That is a very hand wavy attempt at giving you an intuitive feeling for what is happening. I have left several open questions, why is iron a shorter path, and the connection between field lines an energy. The answer to those questions lie in Maxwell's Equations.
 
  • #10
mrspeedybob said:
Dr. Feynman was asked the same question. His answer will give you great insight and it is very simple to understand.


Good video. but it does not answer the question.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #11
That video answers the question perfectly. You just didn't listen to what he was saying.
 
  • #12
What is the physical medium...

Until i figure it out, i'll say "Aether".
Whatever free space is made of, it has magnetic permeability μ0. And that number is significant in elctromagnetics.

Is there universal frame of reference ?
That we haven't found one yet only says to me perhaps its nature is not electromagnetic.

but I'm a plodder.

old jim
 

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