How many electrons to make a stable gravitational object?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the feasibility of creating a stable gravitational object composed solely of electrons, examining the balance between gravitational attraction and electromagnetic repulsion. Participants explore theoretical implications, including the charge-to-mass ratio of electrons and the role of neutrinos in gravitational formation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how many electrons would be needed for their gravitational attraction to overcome electromagnetic repulsion, suggesting that this might be theoretically possible.
  • Another participant notes that the electromagnetic force is 23 orders of magnitude stronger than gravity, implying a significant challenge in forming such an object.
  • There is a suggestion that the charge-to-mass ratio of the electron may prevent the formation of a stable object due to persistent electromagnetic repulsion.
  • A later reply introduces the concept of neutrinos, which are neutral and could potentially form a gravitational object, prompting further inquiry into the number required.
  • One participant humorously remarks on the nature of neutrinos, suggesting they do not form crowds, which adds a light-hearted tone to the discussion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the possibility of forming a stable object from electrons, with some asserting the dominance of electromagnetic forces while others explore the role of neutrinos. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the feasibility of such objects.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the significant difference in strength between electromagnetic and gravitational forces, but the implications of this on the formation of stable objects remain unclear. The discussion also touches on the behavior of neutrinos, which may not conform to typical particle interactions.

Feynstein100
Messages
181
Reaction score
17
I was wondering if we could have an object made up of only electrons. Normally, that wouldn't be possible because electrons repel each other. However, this repulsion can be overcome using gravity. So my question is, how many electrons would you need to have their gravitational attraction overcome the electromagnetic repulsion and form a stable object? Or perhaps is the charge-to-mass ratio of the electron such that the electromagnetic repulsion will always be higher than the gravitational attraction and thus preclude such an object?
Of course, an object like that would not form naturally since the electromagnetic force has the tendency to self-limit via neutralization. So for our purposes, we assume that there aren't any positively charged particles nearby to neutralize our object. There are only electrons.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Feynstein100 said:
So my question is, how many electrons would you need to have their gravitational attraction overcome the electromagnetic repulsion and form a stable object?
What did you find when you did your Google searches to compare the electrostatic force to the gravitational force at typical atomic lattice distances?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Bystander
berkeman said:
What did you find when you did your Google searches to compare the electrostatic force to the gravitational force at typical atomic lattice distances?
That the electromagnetic force is 23 orders of magnitude stronger than gravity.
Feynstein100 said:
Or perhaps is the charge-to-mass ratio of the electron such that the electromagnetic repulsion will always be higher than the gravitational attraction and thus preclude such an object?
So I guess this is the answer?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Dale
Feynstein100 said:
That the electromagnetic force is 23 orders of magnitude stronger than gravity.
Boom! :wink:
 
berkeman said:
Boom! :wink:
I'll take that as a yes 😂 But not so fast. We've still got neutrinos. They don't have charge. So I know you can make a gravitational object out of them 😃 So, indulge me. How many would it take?
 
Neutrinos don't like crowds, so that would not work. They also hate to be anthropomorphized, so I'll have to tie off this thread now before they get their neutrino union involved... :wink:
 
  • Haha
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71, phinds, anorlunda and 1 other person

Similar threads

High School Why don't electrons leave a metal surface?
  • · Replies 28 ·
Replies
28
Views
3K
Graduate Double copies and the black hole electron
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
5K
Undergrad Can a Black Hole be Destroyed by Electron Beam?
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
Undergrad Theoretical Possibility of "Opposite" Gravitational Mass?
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
High School What percent of everyday-life electrons are collapsed?
  • · Replies 46 ·
2
Replies
46
Views
4K
Undergrad The electron as a smeared charge density
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
Graduate How much stuff will neutralise the sun's pull on the earth
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
4K
High School Why don't neutrons bind into large out of control masses?
  • · Replies 28 ·
Replies
28
Views
3K
High School Questions about the Universe: Positive & negative fields and effects
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
Undergrad Is this analogy between Magnetic Force and Gravitational Force accurate in helping to understand what contributes more to a stronger magnetic force?
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K