How to find Torque without Coefficient of Friction?

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SUMMARY

The discussion focuses on calculating torque in a physics problem involving an 8-meter ladder weighing 355 N leaning against a smooth vertical wall at a 50° angle. The key equations derived include the normal forces exerted by the wall and the floor, with the torque balance equation being crucial for solving the problem. The lever arms are calculated as rL = 2.57m and rW = 6.13m, leading to the conclusion that the normal force from the wall (Nw) is -148.833 N. The discussion clarifies the choice of lever arms and the forces considered in the torque equation.

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  • Understanding of torque and lever arms in physics
  • Knowledge of normal forces and friction in static equilibrium
  • Familiarity with free body diagrams and equilibrium equations
  • Basic trigonometry for calculating angles and distances
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Tyler Riley
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Hello! I am an AP Physics student and had a quick question for validity. I was prompted with this question in class today:
Example 7: An 8-meter ladder of weight 355 N leans at an angle of 50° to the floor against a smooth vertical wall. Assume the center of weight (gravity) for the ladder is at its linear center. Find the force exerted by the wall and the floor upon the ladder and the friction between the floor and the ladder.

I wasn't really paying attention and missed a class day of notes so I really don't understand anything really and was hoping you could answer my few questions.
Here is what I copied:

f = floor
r = lever arm
Ff = Friction force
Nf = Normal force or Floor
W = Weight
Nw = Normal force of Wall

rL = (4m)cos(50) = 2.57m
rW = (8m)sin(50) = 6.13m

∑Fy = 0
Nf - W = 0
Nf = W
355 N = 355 N

∑Fx = 0
Ff - Nw = 0

∑τ = 0
-W * rL - Nw * rW = 0
(-355 N) * (2.57) - Nw * (6.13) = 0
-912.35 = Nw * (6.13)
Nw = -148.833

Here are my questions:

Why isn't it (4m)sin(50) instead of (8m)sin(50)?

And why does she plug in
-W
in
-W * rL - Nw * rW = 0
instead of
Nf * μ
in
Nf * μ * rL - Nw * rW = 0
 
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Tyler Riley said:
Why isn't it (4m)sin(50) instead of (8m)sin(50)?
I assume you have a diagram.
When taking moments, you have to choose an axis. Any axis will do, usually, but it helps to pick one which several forces act through. That eliminates them from the torque balance equation since they have no torque about that axis.
The teacher has chosen the point of contact with the floor as the axis. The only forces with moment about that point are the weight of the ladder and the normal force from the wall. What is the lever arm of the force from the wall about the point of contact with the floor?
Tyler Riley said:
And why does she plug in
-W
in
-W * rL - Nw * rW = 0
instead of
Nf * μ
in
Nf * μ * rL - Nw * rW = 0
Same reason.
 

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