I don't feel fine -- I need some moral advice

[Dishsoap]

Getting a raise at my job? No, I would never talk about that to my friends. And I clearly don't understand the scholarship thing, but isn't it very different from an award? Of course I will mention an award, but a scholarship seems to be people helping you with money. I would not talk about that for sure.

I guess my experience as an undergrad so far is that the line between "scholarship" and "award" is very fine, which is something I hadn't previously thought about. When I entered as a freshman, I got a nice scholarship, but as an entering freshman I hadn't really done anything to deserve it besides doing well on some standardized tests, and volunteering. The primary virtue of that accomplishment is that it comes with money, so I'd call it a scholarship.

On the contrary, getting an award like you did, being the best student in the university (congratulations, by the way), is important to you not because it came with money (assuming it did), but because getting it means you're the best damn student in the entire university! Similarly, I won a national award a few years ago for doing research as an undergrad, and the money that came with it was non-negligible, yet I consider it to be an "award" because I would have still been quite proud even if no money had come with it.

I might be rambling a bit, but you raise an interesting point: I wonder if the difference between a scholarship and an award is the importance (not the value) of the money that comes with it - whether it exists to recognize someone for an accomplishment, or to help them pay for school. I don't know :)

 

[micromass]

On the contrary, getting an award like you did, being the best student in the university (congratulations, by the way), is important to you not because it came with money (assuming it did)

Well, it came with 15 euros haha. I couldn't even spend it anywhere, I had to spend it at the official shop of the university. I think it's very clear we don't like to spend money for awards like this. We only really spend money for people in need. I find this way more logical actually than somebody being able to get 4 scholarships because of good grades. But hey, if the system works like this...

But yeah, in the case of awards, I'd have to agree with Feynman

I might be rambling a bit, but you raise an interesting point: I wonder if the difference between a scholarship and an award is the importance (not the value) of the money that comes with it - whether it exists to recognize someone for an accomplishment, or to help them pay for school. I don't know :)

Yeah, I don't really understand this entire scholarship system...

 

[Student100]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

 

[Dishsoap]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

I'm not sure that taking OP on a guilt trip is the way to go. I think it's safe to say that the situation is morally ambiguous - if OP feels bad about taking it, then he/she should give it back. Clearly he does, so that is the best choice.

 

[micromass]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

It's cultural I guess. The OP doesn't really have much expenses and has 4 scholarships. I would feel very guilty with that. But apparently, the culture of the OP makes it more acceptable.

 

[Student100]

It's cultural I guess. The OP doesn't really have much expenses and has 4 scholarships. I would feel very guilty with that. But apparently, the culture of the OP makes it more acceptable.

I guess, he still seems troubled by it which is a good thing.

I couldn't sleep at night knowing I've gamed the system in such a way, but then again, to each his own.

 

[Cruz Martinez]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

Exactly, the question of whether it is worse to get financial help and waste it by being lazy is worse than getting a lot of money out of merit does not change the fact that there will be students in actual NEED of that money, and with comparable merit, who won't get it, because someone has 4 scholarships which he does not strictly need.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

In the US, there are many more need based scholarships than merit based scholarships, and those with true needs will almost always find all the financial aid they need to attend college at a big state university if they can get in. It is unrealistic to suggest that someone who accepts merit based scholarships might be depriving someone who needs the money. Most of the money in merit based scholarships is spent attracting the best students to particular schools and/or attracting and retaining the best students to particular fields, and there are almost always stipulations: attending a specific school, majoring in a specific field, and maintaining a certain GPA. Most merit based scholarships require one to maintain a 3.0 or higher GPA; whereas, most need based scholarships only require maintaining a 2.0.

If there was a student just as deserving for a merit scholarship, odds are they would have been awarded the scholarship also.

 

[Utilite]

I don't understand why the distinction between need and merit based rewards play a central role in the conversation here.

Even if the scholarships were merit based, it's likely that somewhere in the pool of applicants there is a student who is just as deserving who won't be able to attend university because he doesn't have the money needed to go. To just willy-nilly accept all those scholarships, after his tuition and living expenses are paid for, is morally wrong.

Enjoy your vacation money, possibly at the expense of some other student not being able to afford their education.

See, three of my scholarships are just given to some people. If you have the criteria to get it, then you get it. It doesn't affect other people. The last one however, given by a foundation is a limited scholarship. Around 1.500 people applied and I got to last 40. I think I deserved it. And that foundation also grants need based scholarship.
The only thing is I am probably taking away someones vacation money as my own. I mean I can afford a vacation, they probably can't.
I think what disturbs me is, I am saving the money. No of the people at my age make this money unless they invent stuff or write a book or something. I am literally doing nothing and I am saving money. Does this make me a dick?

 

[micromass]

I think what disturbs me is, I am saving the money. No of the people at my age make this money unless they invent stuff or write a book or something. I am literally doing nothing and I am saving money. Does this make me a dick?

You seem to be under the weird impression that it is what you do with the money that would make it immoral. Like you keep saying that you don't spend it and you feel bad because of that. What makes it immoral is not that at all. It is rather you not needing the money, and taking it away from somebody else who might need it to afford an education. Sure, it is clear that in three of the scholarships, this is not the case as they would have given it to everybody who met the criteria. But the fourth one is different. You don't need the money, but you got it anyway. However you spend it is really not an issue.

The only thing is I am probably taking away someones vacation money as my own. I mean I can afford a vacation, they probably can't.

Why do you think you're taking away someone's vacation money? You think this is what it is, vacation money? Maybe people actually need this money to survive and afford an education, and it's not just vacation money...

 

[D H]

I'm going to go against the grain of most of the other answers, @Utilite, and say that the ones you are hurting most are your parents.

Take your scholarships without grief, but earn them. The way you earn them as a student is to be as good a student as those merit-based scholarship organizations think you will be. If you're as good as they think you are, you (or someone who capitalizes on your brilliant ideas) will eventually be donating lots and lots of money to those organizations. That's the bet on which those scholarship organizations are gambling.

With regard to your student friends, the best path to joining them on a scholarship-free path through college is to use those scholarship monies to PARTY! This is not a good path. Another one of your responsibilities as a highly gifted person is to help those who are of just above-average intelligence see how to solve problems. Even if you don't get rich or don't have fantastically lucrative ideas, that your intuitive insight might help create a billionaire (who would otherwise have been mediocre) is another one of those gambles made by those merit-based scholarship organizations.

On the other hand, your parents most likely didn't take that African Safari, a trip to the Americas, or go to New Zealand and Australia because they had you as a child and because they had limited finances. You are taking advantage of your parents by taking their money when you do not need it. Now is the time (before they die) for them to take those trips they have long longed to take, but without you and your siblings in tow. Let them do that by telling them that you don't need their money to get through college.

 

[Student100]

In the US, there are many more need based scholarships than merit based scholarships, and those with true needs will almost always find all the financial aid they need to attend college at a big state university if they can get in. It is unrealistic to suggest that someone who accepts merit based scholarships might be depriving someone who needs the money. Most of the money in merit based scholarships is spent attracting the best students to particular schools and/or attracting and retaining the best students to particular fields, and there are almost always stipulations: attending a specific school, majoring in a specific field, and maintaining a certain GPA. Most merit based scholarships require one to maintain a 3.0 or higher GPA; whereas, most need based scholarships only require maintaining a 2.0.

If there was a student just as deserving for a merit scholarship, odds are they would have been awarded the scholarship also.

I'm not sure why you believe this is true. The massive amount of student debt in the US says anything but this.

 

[Utilite]

I'm going to go against the grain of most of the other answers, @Utilite, and say that the ones you are hurting most are your parents.
On the other hand, your parents most likely didn't take that African Safari, a trip to the Americas, or go to New Zealand and Australia because they had you as a child and because they had limited finances. You are taking advantage of your parents by taking their money when you do not need it. Now is the time (before they die) for them to take those trips they have long longed to take, but without you and your siblings in tow. Let them do that by telling them that you don't need their money to get through college.

See, I am insisting for my parents to enjoy their retirement more but I guess they are like me. They stay home all the time... My father takes care of my grandfather and the house and my mother knits and cooks and stuff like that. She from time to time visits her sisters at a different city. My father didn't even leave the country, he has some kind of flight phobia. I guess I am just like them only younger.
@micromass I pretty sure that I am not hurting those who really need the money because government almost always helps those need the money and successful enough to earn this scholarship. Also by vacation money I meant money they could just spend buying stuff and partying or even save some up. This is not the kind of scholarship designed for students to pay up the college debt.

 

[jim hardy]

Somebody said it already -
Just measure up to the expectations of your benefactors.
Use the money sparingly, live a no frills lifestyle, and when you graduate turn what's left back into the institution that gave it to you so they can help somebody else. Dissipation doesn't lead to a successful life.

Image courtesy Leanin' Tree cards
http://www.leanintree.com/personalized-birthday-card-2001254-p.htmlmy two cents

old jim

 

[Dr. Courtney]

I'm not sure why you believe this is true. The massive amount of student debt in the US says anything but this.

The accumulation of debt does not necessarily indicate need, it indicates people who desire to live beyond their means.

A student can easily add $12,000 per year to their college expenses simply by attending a college where they cannot live at home. This may be necessary in some cases, but most of the US population lives within commuting distance of schools which provide very cost effective education for the first two years, and distance learning programs are also rapidly growing.

Many students also accumulate great debt by eschewing more cost effective schools with in-state tuition and choosing to go into debt to attend private schools and schools in other states.

Another factor that contributes to debt accumulation is students screw around and take 5-6 years to earn degrees that are reasonably earned in 4 years. That's a lot of additional debt and delay in starting to repay it.

In any given case, it's not hard to sit down with a student and craft a college education plan with very little or no debt. But in many cases, they need to be willing to live at home (at least for the first two years), need to work hard, need to live frugally, and need to make the most cost effective choices rather than being more motivated to get out from their parents' watchful eyes to drink, party, and screw around.

 

[Student100]

The accumulation of debt does not necessarily indicate need, it indicates people who desire to live beyond their means.

A student can easily add $12,000 per year to their college expenses simply by attending a college where they cannot live at home. This may be necessary in some cases, but most of the US population lives within commuting distance of schools which provide very cost effective education for the first two years, and distance learning programs are also rapidly growing.

Many students also accumulate great debt by eschewing more cost effective schools with in-state tuition and choosing to go into debt to attend private schools and schools in other states.

Another factor that contributes to debt accumulation is students screw around and take 5-6 years to earn degrees that are reasonably earned in 4 years. That's a lot of additional debt and delay in starting to repay it.

In any given case, it's not hard to sit down with a student and craft a college education plan with very little or no debt. But in many cases, they need to be willing to live at home (at least for the first two years), need to work hard, need to live frugally, and need to make the most cost effective choices rather than being more motivated to get out from their parents' watchful eyes to drink, party, and screw around.

This is a gross over simplification. Let's look at where I went to school, UCSD, 2015-2016 tuition & budgeting estimates for students who live at home is currently 25,200. I don't know personally very many people who could afford that without supplementing with student loans. Even the most frugal students will be out 20,000 when tuition, books, supplies, parking permits, transportation etc, are accounted for. This is for students who live with their parents.

Without the GI bill I could have never went to school. My parents are simply poor, with no money to spare for such things. Not to mention I lived in the rural south, and the closest in state school was two hours away. Even with the GI bill I took on about 10,000 in debt, while working, attending a community college for the first two years and having a savings before I quit my job to attend university.

Maybe students could get by without loans when you went to school, I doubt for very many students this is realistic anymore.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

This is a gross over simplification. Let's look at where I went to school, UCSD, 2015-2016 tuition & budgeting estimates for students who live at home is currently 25,200.

You didn't live within driving distance of a community college? There are lots of community colleges in the San Diego area.

If you didn't qualify for need based aid, why weren't your parents willing to help with expenses?

How much of that $4,698 UCSD figures for housing and meals of students living with their parents did you actually spend or repay to your parents?

How much of that $1833 figured for health insurance did you actually repay to your parents if they kept you on their insurance? How many students who actually need to provide their own health insurance will not qualify for need-based aid (grants and scholarships) that do not need to be repaid)?

Or are you being dishonest with the notion that a student living with their parents actually needs to come up with anywhere near $25k a year to attend college in the San Diego area? Several affordable schools in the area require cash out of pocket much closer to $8k per year.

If you cannot afford a top 25 school, do not attend a top 25 school. One should not blame someone who accepts a merit based scholarship for their own inability to live beyond their means. Post four semesters of 4.0 GPAs at a more humble institution, and get the profs to write you great letters of recommendation. You will be able to afford your junior and senior years.

There are some rural areas that are not within commuting distance of affordable schools, but there is now a plethora of distance learning options available at community college prices. Many schools even charge in-state tuition rates for distance learning courses taken by students in other states - some as low as $5k-$6k a year for a full time course load.

 

[Evo]

Time to say goodbye to this thread as it has gone off topic.