I don't understnad how to get the 4-volume element for a Minkowksi space

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the 4-volume element in Minkowski space, specifically the role of the square root of the determinant of the metric tensor in transforming volume elements between different coordinate frames. The scope includes theoretical aspects of general relativity and mathematical reasoning related to volume elements and metric transformations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the volume element is expressed as \(\sqrt{|-g|}d^{4}x\) and questions the necessity of the square root of the determinant of -g, suggesting it might relate to the Jacobian of \(g_{\mu\nu}\).
  • Another participant clarifies that in Minkowski space, the metric is diagonal with entries (-1,1,1,1) and states that the volume element simplifies to \(d^4 x' = \sqrt{-g}d^4 x\), indicating that the determinant is -1, thus the volume element is multiplied by one.
  • A participant expresses a desire for a mathematical explanation of why the square root of the determinant of -g is used for transforming volume elements between frames.
  • Another participant asserts that the volume element in Minkowski space is invariant under Lorentz transformations and suggests that the factor is redundant in this context.
  • One participant proposes considering a transformation \(x' = ax\) and discusses how the metric and volume element transform under this transformation, hinting at the tensor transformation law and algebraic methods to derive the line element transformation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity and implications of the square root of the determinant of the metric in the context of volume elements. There is no consensus on the explanation for its use or its redundancy in Minkowski space.

Contextual Notes

Some participants mention the Jacobian and transformations without fully resolving the mathematical steps involved. The discussion highlights the complexity of metric transformations and the assumptions underlying the use of volume elements in different coordinate systems.

Lyalpha
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I see that it is \sqrt{|-g|}d^{4}x but I'm not sure why it needs to be multiplied by the square root of the determinant of -g. It must be the Jacobian of g_{μ\nu} or something right? So I guess I'm asking how do you calculate the Jacobian of the metric.
 
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In Minkowski space the coordiates are orthonormal. The diagonal of the metric is (-1,1,1,1) with all other entries zero.

The expression you gave should be \sqrt{-g}, where g is the determinate of the metric. It means you take the square root of the negative of the determinate of the metric. The determinate is -1, so the volume element in Minkowski space is just multipled by one.

d^4 x' = \sqrt{-g}d^4 x

What we are doing with \sqrt{-g} is translating between a volume element in x' coordinates to orthonormal minkowski volume elements in the unprimed frame.
 
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Yes but why do we use the square root of the determinate of -g to transform between volume elements in different frames? I'd like to see the math of it.
 
The volume element in the Minkowski metric is invariant under Lorentz transformations. You can show this by explicitly computing the Jacobian for a Lorentz Transformation.

That factor is redundant in Minkowski space-time.
 
Consider the transformation x' = ax

Consider how the metric transforms under this transformation (from t,x,y,z to t,x',y,z), and how the volume element tranforms under this transformation.

Hint:

A unit volume 4- cube has dt, dy, and dz the same, but dx' = a dx.

We can use the tensor transformation law to transform the metric, or just algebra. To use just algebra, we write the line element in terms of dx,dy,dz and we use again use the formula dx' = a dx.

So a line element of -dt^2 + dx^2 + dy^2 + dz^2 transforms into -dt^2 + dx'^2/a^2 + dy^2 + dz^2

This isn't a completely general derivation , but should (hopefully) give you a good intiutive feeling for questions like "where did that square root come from"
 

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