Job Skills I Feel like there is no way I will land a STEM job

[homeylova223]

This job search problem historically has popped up whenever there are more graduates in a field than there are jobs. It happened in the Aerospace industry when NASA started to cut back. It has always been there for Astronomy, Physics and other teaching/research-oriented fields as there are too few academic positions and so few in the field get jobs.

One big trend has been in Data Sciences, AI, Machine Learning and Deep Learning. These fields are hot and with the Quantum Computer on the horizon in big demand. Likewise for cutting edge Biology and Medical fields.

Ups and Downs example:

Big Oil recently was on a hiring binge and couldn't get enough grads. The reason was a general reluctance to hire new people until it became clear that they were losing too many senior people to retirement. This binge then sets up increased student enrollment in Oil-related fields and now once again we have an Oil downturn with the price battle between the Saudis and the Russians and prospects for new grads are much dimmer.

Bottomline

Things are constantly changing and you must adapt.

You have a point that skills are important.But another important thing that is overlooked for entry level is knowing somebody in the industry. Even if you have the skills a lot of times when applying to a company you can will run into these HR Johnnies who will make you do a million psychological assessment and then not even reply to you.

I think its a mix of luck of having skills yes but also knowing somebody and having those connections.

 

[jedishrfu]

You definitely need to get past the HR firewall. One way is targetting your resume to the job you're applying to (and keep a copy of EVERYTHING you send to them -- for reference in case you get an interview). Targetting may get you past any machine learning filter.

If you've done your research then you should be able to find people who are working there who have published papers or done seminars something you can use in an email to them. You may strike a chord, establish a node for your network and then get insight on how to get a job there.

 

[homeylova223]

I guess that could emailing someone in the company. Say you want to work in the department of defense in some project which interest you, I guess you could try emailing who is in charge of the project as a way to get around the whole application hassle.

 

[jedishrfu]

I guess that could emailing someone in the company. Say you want to work in the department of defense in some project which interest you, I guess you could try emailing who is in charge of the project as a way to get around the whole application hassle.

This strategy may work well with industry but is not recommended with gov't sponsored projects.

The point is to build a network of professional friends using the tools of today, LinkedIn, Indeed or Monster and to network with people at professional conferences. You can write someone who presented a paper you liked and to discuss projects where it might apply to build up an expertise with the person that could lead to a job.

 

[Vanadium 50]

It is probably worth looking at the past messages of people who are replying to you to see what their own experiences have been.

 

[hutchphd]

Also the HR hassle is often much less onerous at a small (probably startup) company. Unfortunately these opportunities are often filled by word of mouth. Are there startups near where you live? If you don't know, where can you find out? (local college profs., business directories, etc.) . Call these places and see if you can come to them and talk for a few minutes about what they do. This is hard work! Word of mouth.
Incidentally small (point-of-care) medical instruments might just be an explosive growth industry. They require (bio)chemistry, electronics (analog and digital), optics, systems, programming... You just need one decent job to start. Keep at it.

 

[Locrian]

I guess that could emailing someone in the company. Say you want to work in the department of defense in some project which interest you, I guess you could try emailing who is in charge of the project as a way to get around the whole application hassle.

Note that with larger companies this is unlikely to help with the application hassle. However, having an advocate in the room where the hiring discussions are being made is a huge advantage.

As a hiring manager at a large company I've gotten plenty of "Can you look at my resume" or "Are you hiring?" messages on LinkedIn. These typically fit two categories. The first, are folks just asking for a job; no real questions, no conversation, just requests (or demands!) for a review. Others are folks who genuinely seem interested in the department, and have interesting questions about it. Some of those questions turn into conversations, and sometimes turn into lunch or other meetings. Guess who has an edge?

To be clear, the goal here isn't to have lunch with someone. My point is that if you seem engaged and communicate your abilities in a way that results in someone deciding their time is worth further communication, this is valuable asset in the decision making process. It's not a guarantee, but it does up the odds.

 

[sysprog]

I've never been a 'person with the power to hire you' but I've conducted some technical interviews, and not one candidate ever passed my interview -- most of them weren't good enough, and one of them out-and-out and provably lied -- so the boss decided to stop letting me screen candidates -- he hired a guy who was technically a doofus who thought he he could win by intimidation -- that didn't work on me -- that guy didn't stay for very long -- the idiot boss who hired him didn't either -- I left that company soon thereafter to work for another company.

The vagaries of the employment market are often capricious.

Please try to find a job such that you can share a sense of mission.

 

[sysprog]

I guess that could emailing someone in the company. Say you want to work in the department of defense in some project which interest you, I guess you could try emailing who is in charge of the project as a way to get around the whole application hassle.

That shirt doesn't button properly in DoD.

 

[Jody]

What has worked for me is catering my resume. I'm not suggesting you look up the job and copy the bullets into your resume, but massaging a few of those buzzwords in and playing the verbiage works; this also is not a suggestion to lie (very bad of course). I've never known anyone prior to the interview at any of the three jobs I've had so far; one was smaller aerospace company and the other two are Behemoths.

 

[sysprog]

You won't find buttons misaligned to buttonholes on a mil-spec shirt.

 

[homeylova223]

22 million are now claiming unemployment benefits.
https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/us-coronavirus-unemployment-claims-jump-april-11
I just hope companies do not do mass layoffs.

More than 10% of the American workforce is unemployed. I wonder how of these people have stem jobs. This is not good and I fear we will need more stimulation but too much stimulation of the economy will lead to inflation you cannot stimulate the economy too much or the things will get out of control high prices.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

More than 10% of the American workforce is unemployed. I wonder how of these people have stem jobs.

All the STEM teachers I know are still working. STEM jobs in the oil industry are already hard hit, or about to be. Things vary widely with the industry and area of the country.

 

[Zap]

My go-to is 50-100 apps per day. You will find something.

 

[jedishrfu]

A key point is to not only apply but to focus your resume on the job. Generic resumes just don't cut it.

In addition, you should keep copies of everything you send in including cover letters, resumes and applications in case you get a call for interview.

These papers are what they will use to ask you further questions and since youve focused your resume you’ll want to recall what you sent them.

 

[Dr. Courtney]

My go-to is 50-100 apps per day. You will find something.

While I admire the notion that one's job while unemployed is to apply for jobs, I recommend a more targeted application approach than 50-100 applications per day. The focus should be on quality of applications rather than on quantity.

Significant research is needed to match each application to each open position. What is the company really looking for? I go beyond the description of the position in the announcement. With a few internet searches, the diligent applicant can usually find who the hiring manager is and who some people occupying similar positions are at the company. Perusing their LinkedIn and other public profiles can give a lot of insight on what the company is looking for. I also take due care to understand the background and publications of everyone I can determine is on the hiring committee.

I've got many, many pages of work experience, education, publications, and accomplishments in what I call my "long form CV." So do students I mentor, even those much younger than I am with only a fraction of the experience. The goal of the long form CV is to contain everything that might be needed on a resume tailored for a specific job. Then material is carefully selected for a 1-2 page resume for a specific position. Due care and consideration is also taken in answering other questions and fields in the application process. Everything is proof-read carefully before hitting the "submit" button.

The goal is to frame background, education, and experience to one's best advantage for each specific job. Even with experience and the needed materials "ready at hand" each application takes several hours.

 

[Locrian]

Significant research is needed to match each application to each open position.

For those earlier in their career, I don't recommend this approach. Entry level positions aren't really that different within an industry, and entry level folks don't have enough experience to have something meaningfully different for every version of the resume.

For early-career folks on the search, here's my suggestion: review the skills and terms for the jobs you're applying to. Most likely the positions can be grouped by position, industry, or some combination. Create 3 - 5 different versions of your resume tailored to these types of roles. Each time you encounter a posting, pick a template, take just a few minutes to fine tune the language to that of the posting, and then fire away.

This method allows you to target postings quickly. Save the "significant research" for when you're preparing for the interview.

 

[symbolipoint]

@Dr. Courtney, about post #6 #46 just goes too far for many open positions. Still, any applicant should take some care in that direction. The more the applicant knows about the job, the better the applicant can judge if or how he is qualified for the job, and the better the applicant can express this to the prospective employer both in writing (like resume & cover letter) and in interview ( by phone and in person).

In case an applicant has significant list of positions and accomplishments to create a several-page "CV" and is applying for entry-level, something is very wrong.

(yes, small edit also made for which post ref'd.)

 

[berkeman]

@Dr. Courtney, about post #6 just goes too far for many open positions. Still, any applicant should take some care in that direction.

I think you mean post #46, not #6

In case an applicant has significant list of positions and accomplishments to create a several-page "CV" and is applying for entry-level, something is very wrong.

I think @Dr. Courtney was referring to mostly non-entry-level-position jobs, but as you know from his posting history, he mentors many students though college who end up with extensive in-school work/TA histories and research backgrounds. Jut because you freshly graduated from college does not mean that you don't have lots of relevant experience to put on your resume.

 

[Locrian]

Some of it also may depend on how many positions actually turn up in your search area. If there are only a handful of open positions that turn up in a season, well, research away! Why not invest the time? Then I get what Dr. Courtney was saying.

On the other end of the spectrum, I don't know how one actually sends out 100 resumes a day for any real length of time. Are there 3,000 positions in your field you can apply to in a month?

I think most folks are in the middle, where they can and probably should send out a few resumes a day. For me, that calls for some middle ground between shotgunning the same resume everywhere and (at the other extreme) spending inordinate time tailoring your resume for a company that may not even acknowledge you sent it.

 

[CrysPhys]

Some of it also may depend on how many positions actually turn up in your search area. If there are only a handful of open positions that turn up in a season, well, research away! Why not invest the time? Then I get what Dr. Courtney was saying.

On the other end of the spectrum, I don't know how one actually sends out 100 resumes a day for any real length of time. Are there 3,000 positions in your field you can apply to in a month?

I think most folks are in the middle, where they can and probably should send out a few resumes a day. For me, that calls for some middle ground between shotgunning the same resume everywhere and (at the other extreme) spending inordinate time tailoring your resume for a company that may not even acknowledge you sent it.

^^^Yes.^^^ And some job posts may be for positions that don't actually exist. In expectation of funding for a new project, we would often publish posts in advance to gather resumes, and sometimes even interview promising candidates in advance, so we'd be ready to roll once the funding came through. But if the funding didn't come through ... oh, well, never mind. And then there were the bizarre cases in which an opening did exist, and an existing employee had already been selected to fill it, but HR forced us to post it anyways to satisfy anti-discrimination or diversity (or whatever you call it these days) regulations. Just one of the many reasons why it's so important to develop personal networks (and I don't mean shotgunning people on LinkedIn).

 

[Zap]

On the other end of the spectrum, I don't know how one actually sends out 100 resumes a day for any real length of time. Are there 3,000 positions in your field you can apply to in a month?

50-100 applications per day should be the target. If one actually accomplishes this over the course of a week, they will most likely have to keep track of the callbacks and initial interviews coming their way the following week. If that's the case, no harm in chilling out a bit so you can keep track of which companies are calling you back, research those companies who have and to study up on the positions that are calling you back.

This approach has always worked for me. I got a job offer a few weeks ago. I am waiting on the background check. After which, I should start shortly!

This is just my opinion, though. Others probably have alternative methods for seeking employment that have worked well for them. I am only sharing my perspective.

If you find you can't find 50 applications per day to apply to, than maybe branch out a bit and apply to jobs you normally would not. My approach is for newbies, and being a newbie myself, this is the approach I use. It will get you noticed in one way or another. You might not find your dream job, but you will find something.

i am always applying to jobs related to IT so there’s always a plentiful pool of applications to fill out. Someone with a math or physics degree, with some excel, MATLAB and statistics experience, which you should have, can as well apply to similar jobs.

from my experience, I did not receive any callbacks or interviews until I used this kind of, perhaps controversial, method. So, it’s tried and true for me, but again, this is only my point of view. Others are just as valid, or even more valid. I don’t know.

I'd also like to note that a few weeks ago I was beginning training as a salesforce developer that would have put me in New York City with a decent salary, which I have zero experience with. I decided not to pursue that because the other job I was offered sounded cooler. So, you don't necessarily have to have experience to get a job. I've found business analytics to be somewhat boring, but it's something that even someone with a physics degree could do , and sometimes having only potential is good enough.

 

[homeylova223]

My problem with STEM jobs is I feel they are so picky. So its like what do you prioritize on. For example I saw a job for data analyst for data analyst at telsa. The requirement were sql, python, strong interpersonal skills, strong communication skills, an ability to think outside of the box, the ability to think deductively. And data visualization/analysis skills. So I sometimes I wonder am I better of learning python or learning how to think rationally by reviewing how to do math proof proof by contradiction proof by contrapositive etcetera. Which software am I better off focusing on python,sql, excel sometimes I feel I don't have the time to learn them all.

 

[Vanadium 50]

This doesn't look picky to me.

SQL: This is probably the pickiest, but if their data is in DB2 (or whatever) it's not unreasonable to want the people responsible for looking at it to know how to look at it.

Python: "Hi, I want to want to be a data scientist for you but don't know Python" won't go very far. Other things that won't go very far are:

strong interpersonal skills : "I like alienating my colleagues."
strong communication skills : "My job will be to communicate what I have learned by looking at the data, but I am not good at that"
an ability to think outside of the box: "I will only work on things placed right in front of me. I will do what I am told and only what I am told. If you want a mindless automaton, I'm your guy!"
the ability to think deductively: "Logic is for suckers."

 

[Zap]

Python and SQL are very easy to learn. You will be surprised how user friendly they are.

 

[Mondayman]

I live in a fairly large Canadian city. I don't think its possible to submit 50-100 resumes per day where I live unless you are talking about anything from STEM to manual labor. There just aren't enough jobs around.

 

[Zap]

When I mentioned 50-100 resumes per day, I also mentioned targeting an in-demand job. I do it with IT, because you can find 50-100 job applications per day.

 

[osilmag]

I think I'm kind of slow to grasp concepts and I don't fit in among intellectuals. I lost all my confidence in college despite doing well. I could tell everyone in my lab thought I was stupid and disinterested. I don't have what it takes to just listen to lectures and grasp everything, but put it in writing and I can learn all of it if given enough time. But I always felt rushed in college, so maybe I'm just not smart enough. Imo, most people can learn about anything if given enough time. I would put myself in that boat, but I'm just slow.

I am able to get responses to my applications, but as I am 3 years removed from college, I don't fare very well anymore. I also have no one I can use as a reference from my school.

I studied biochemistry.
Yes, I have a psychiatrist. That is an encouraging story you tell and I will try to keep it in mind.

Sorry guys, I did not mean to join this forum to rant. I wanted to self study physics and be like Tesla. However, just wandering through some of the non-homework stuff on this board made me realize I was out of my element. Threw me into a depressive spiral. This whole Coronavirus thing is bumming me out as well.Honestly, I think it's over. I probably won't be using my degree. Not a big deal as long as I can find something, anything, that I'm decent at and can do for a living.

I would not jump to the conclusion that people think you are stupid especially in biochemistry.

You could always turn that around and call them nerds.

I will also tell you that if you think that you will not get a STEM job, you probably won't get one. Changing your outlook about it could help.