I thought springs can only pull

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    Pull Springs
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of springs in a scenario where two masses are connected by a cord and a spring. Participants explore the mechanics of how springs can push blocks apart when the cord is cut, questioning the initial conditions and forces at play. The scope includes conceptual understanding of spring dynamics and momentum conservation.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why the spring would push the blocks apart if they were initially at rest, suggesting that the spring should pull the blocks together instead.
  • Another participant challenges the assumption that the spring is neither stretched nor compressed when the blocks are at rest, prompting further inquiry into the initial conditions.
  • A later reply emphasizes that a spring exerts a restoring force that can either push or pull, depending on the perturbation from its equilibrium state.
  • One participant clarifies that the blocks were initially pushed together, which was balanced by the spring force, leading to a net force of zero. They question whether the only opposing force to the spring is the tension in the cord or if there is an additional applied force.
  • Another participant explains that when the cord is intact, it keeps the blocks together and the spring compressed, storing energy that is released when the cord breaks, resulting in the blocks being pushed apart.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the initial conditions of the system and the forces involved, indicating that multiple competing interpretations remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are assumptions regarding the initial state of the spring and the forces acting on the blocks that are not fully clarified, leading to potential misunderstandings about the mechanics involved.

reyrey389
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http://faculty.mint.ua.edu/~pleclair/ph125/Misc/exam2_form_a_solns.pdf

On page 1, problem 1, where it shows a mass M and another mass 3M connected by a cord and spring. Then the cord is burned off, and then the spring "pushes the blocks away" I get the momentum conservation and how to work the problem, but I don't get why the springs would behave like this and push the blocks? If the blocks were at rest initially, then the spring is neither stretched nor compressed, it is at its relaxed state and so it has no energy at all. But even if it did, this would come from kinetic energy of the blocks moving to the left/right, and stretching the spring to the left/right, so then the moment the cord is cut , wouldn't the spring *pull* the blocks towards each other ?

Thanks
 
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reyrey389 said:
If the blocks were at rest initially, then the spring is neither stretched nor compressed
Why?
 
reyrey389 said:
but I don't get why the springs would behave like this and push the blocks? If the blocks were at rest initially, then the spring is neither stretched nor compressed, it is at its relaxed state and so it has no energy at all.
You didn't read the problem correctly did you :wink: ...

spring problem.GIF


Reread the second sentence ... what does it say ?cheers
Dave
 
The idea that a spring pulls back to its relaxed state after being stretched is merely one particular case of a more general statement about springs. Namely, if the length of a spring is perturbed from its equilibrium length, the spring exerts a restoring force, opposite to the perturbation, that attempts to recover the equilibrium situation. The perturbation can, of course, be in either direction, so the restoring force can be a push or a pull.
 
Yeah I read it wrong, from what I understand, the blocks were initially pushed towards each other and this was balanced by the spring force, to give a net force of zero, and to keep the blocks at rest. But the forces that oppose the spring force pushing the blocks away, is it only the tension in the cord , or is there an additional applied force from the persons hand squeezing them together ? It makes more sense this way, cause if the blocks are at rest, I can't picture how Tension alone can pull them towards each other. So shouldn't F_applied + Tension = Spring Force (Initially) or is it only Tension = Spring Force
 
the blocks are pushed close together, compressing the spring between them. Whilst they are in that state, the cord is attached between the 2 blocks
to keep them together ( and the spring compressed). The cord is under tension, the compressed spring has stored energy
when the cord breaks, the energy in the spring is released, returning it to its uncompressed state and also pushing the blocks apartDave
 

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