Integration under the integral sign

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the technique of integration under the integral sign, exploring its applications, benefits, and the relationships between different integrals. Participants share their understanding and confusion regarding the method, particularly in relation to specific examples and the process of differentiation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the purpose of the integration under the integral sign method and its relation to obtaining a "real" answer.
  • Another participant suggests that this method can reduce a complex integral to a simpler one, indicating that differentiation of the final result is not always necessary.
  • A participant expresses confusion about the relationship between specific equations in the example provided, seeking clarification on how one equation is derived from another.
  • Further clarification is provided regarding the use of Fubini's theorem to interchange the order of integration, which may simplify the evaluation of the integral.
  • Participants discuss the importance of recognizing equivalent integrals to facilitate easier calculations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding and confusion about the method, indicating that multiple views and interpretations exist regarding its application and effectiveness. No consensus is reached on the clarity of the example provided.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note that the example page may lack clarity, which could contribute to misunderstandings about the technique and its application. There are also unresolved questions regarding the derivation of specific equations from one another.

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Hello all who read,
I was reading along in the book Advanced Calculus by Frederick S. Woods today and came upon this technique. I played with it a little on some sample problems, but I still cannot figure out what it has any relation to.

My questions I guess are that,
(1) what does this method help to accomplish
(2) Do I have to differentiate the final result to have a "real" answer
(3) Why is the end result seem only related to the beginning by an integration operation

I may just be completely lost, and all these things be trivial. but any help would be great, thanks!

Here is a link to an example http://mathworld.wolfram.com/IntegrationUndertheIntegralSign.html"
 
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(3)The problem is worked backwards (6) is the answer.
(2)This method could be used in different ways. As used in the link you do not have to differentiate the final result to have a "real" answer.
(1)This method could be used in different ways. As used in the link one reduces an integral to an easier one.

The idea of your example is
Problem: Compute an integral
1)The integral is hard now what?
Write the integral as two integrals iterated.
2)Now there are two integrals How did that help?
In some cases the integrals are easy in revese order and give the same answer
3)Reverse order of integrals (and justify to desired level of rigor).
This integral is easy
4)Do easy integral.
Done, rejoice.
 
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That makes sense, thanks.
 
Sorry for bump and double post,

but I seem to still not understand after doing a few more examples, and trying to "Differentiate under the integral" of the integral in (6). That was quite futile for me.

In that link, is the Integral to be solved (6)?

If yes, how was the equation (2) deduced from (6)?

Thanks for the help!
 
Perhaps the example page could be written more clearly. Evaluating the integral in (6) is the goal of that work. The trick in that example is to recognize that

\frac{x^b-x^a}{\ln x} = \int_a^b d\alpha x^\alpha.

So, if you want to calculate

\int_0^1 dx~\frac{x^b-x^a}{\ln x},
you can start by replacing with integrand with the equivalent integral. Then, you can interchange the order of the integrals (by Fubini's theorem, assuming it applies), and it turns out that the integral \int_0^1 dx~x^\alpha is easier to do than the original integral, and is just equal to 1/(\alpha+1) (for \alpha \neq -1).

So, you've reduced the original problem - evaulating the integral in (6) - to evaluating

\int_a^b d\alpha~\frac{1}{\alpha+1}.

So, to summarize:

If you have a hard integral to do, but you recognize your integrand as being equivalent to another integral, you can replace the integrand with the equivalent integral, and then using Fubini's theorem you can change the order of integration. The inner integral is hopefully relatively easy to do, so you can perform that integral, and then hopefully you end up with a new integrand that's easier to integrate than the original integrand.
 
That's quite a lot easier to follow!

Thanks!
 
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