Lorentz Contraction & Twin Paradox

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the twin paradox and its relationship to Lorentz contraction and the work of Lorentz and FitzGerald, particularly whether the paradox can be constructed using only their contributions without invoking special relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the twin paradox is fundamentally connected to special relativity but question if it can be derived solely from Lorentz's and FitzGerald's work.
  • One participant suggests that while Lorentz's work includes length contraction, it may not be sufficient to construct the twin paradox independently of the broader framework of relativity.
  • Another participant notes that Lorentz derived the Lorentz transforms before Einstein, but believed they were merely mathematical adjustments for electromagnetic phenomena, not a complete theory of relativity.
  • There is a contention that referring to Lorentz contraction implies a connection to relativity, as time dilation is also a concept rooted in that framework.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the twin paradox can be understood through Lorentz's work alone, indicating a lack of consensus on the matter.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the definitions of Lorentz contraction and time dilation are not fully explored, and the discussion does not resolve the implications of Lorentz's mathematical contributions versus the conceptual framework established by Einstein.

Mickey1
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TL;DR
Does Lorentz contraction point to the twin paradox
The twin paradox is connected to the special relativity but I wonder simply if one might construct the paradox (or something very similar) based on the Lorentz’ (and FitzGerald) work alone?

Several ingredients in the paradox, time dilation and Lorentz contraction, are often mentioned with reference only to Lorentz without any mention of relativity.
 
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Mickey1 said:
The twin paradox is connected to the special relativity but I wonder simply if one might construct the paradox (or something very similar) based on the Lorentz’ (and FitzGerald) work alone?
I don't know.
Mickey1 said:
Several ingredients in the paradox, time dilation and Lorentz contraction, are often mentioned with reference only to Lorentz without any mention of relativity.

In its simplest form, the twin paradox is the analogy in Minkowski geometry of the triangle inequality in Euclidean geometry. More generally, the proper time that elapses along the worldline of an object is equivalent to the invariant spacetime distance along the worldline.
 
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Mickey1 said:
The twin paradox is connected to the special relativity but I wonder simply if one might construct the paradox (or something very similar) based on the Lorentz’ (and FitzGerald) work alone?
Well, length contraction alone won't get you there (and I don't think a theory with length contraction alone would really be self-consistent). Lorentz actually derived the Lorentz transforms, which are the mathematical core of relativity, before Einstein. As far as I know, though, he believed them to be just a mathematical fix for Maxwell's equations, so something that was only relevant to electromagnetic waves and fields and the like, until shown otherwise by Einstein.

So Lorentz had the maths to set up the twin paradox, but not the conceptual framework in which to think of it. So in answer to your question I'd say "maybe, it kinda depends what you think of as Lorentz's work".
 
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Mickey1 said:
Several ingredients in the paradox, time dilation and Lorentz contraction, are often mentioned with reference only to Lorentz without any mention of relativity.

If you refer to Lorentz contraction, you are referring to something that's a part of relativity. Likewise for time dilation.
 
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