Lorentz Force Question - Where did the y dot come from ?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of the Lorentz Force in the context of a Penning ion trap. The original poster presents a potential function and seeks to understand the appearance of a velocity term in the equations of motion for a charged particle in a magnetic field.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the components of the Lorentz Force and the implications of the velocity terms in the equations of motion. There is confusion regarding the interpretation of the potential and the role of the velocity in the force equations.

Discussion Status

Some participants have clarified the meaning of the velocity term, while others express disagreement with the interpretation of the force components. The discussion is exploring different interpretations of the equations and the relationships between the variables involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating through potential misunderstandings regarding the definitions of terms and the vector nature of the forces involved. The context includes specific equations and components that are critical to the problem but may not be fully resolved.

Physics Enemy
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Basically the question is about a penning ion trap. You need to use the equation for the Lorentz Force, which I have. It says the trap electrodes have a potential:

V(x,y,z) = A(2z^2 - x^2 - y^2); There's a superimposed uniform B-Field B = B(z hat)

It then asks you to write down an expression for the z-component of the total electromagnetic force on a particle of charge q, explaining why it doesn't depend on B. I did that. It then says write down the equation of motion. I did that.

It then asks you to do the same thing with the x and y components i.e.) Find the x and y components of the total force, write down the equations of motion, etc.

But the solution shows a y dot in the equation of motion in the x-direction:

x double dot = q/m[2Ax + B(y dot)]

Where did this y dot come into it? Any ideas? I thought a V term is next to B?
Thanks guys, muchly appreciated. :smile:
 
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[tex]\dot{y}[/tex] is the y-component of the velocity.
 
fzero said:
[tex]\dot{y}[/tex] is the y-component of the velocity.
Thanks, I realized a few mins ago lol. The x and z cross to give the y-direction. For some reason I also thought V was potential, not velocity. It's a little v, of course. :redface:
 
I actually disagree with their answer, shouldn't it be -y dot? x cross z gives -y, I think ...
 
Physics Enemy said:
I actually disagree with their answer, shouldn't it be -y dot? x cross z gives -y, I think ...

The equation you wrote above was for this [tex]x[/tex] component of the force, which contains [tex](\vec{v} \times \vec{B})_x = v_y B_z[/tex].
 
fzero said:
The equation you wrote above was for this [tex]x[/tex] component of the force, which contains [tex](\vec{v} \times \vec{B})_x = v_y B_z[/tex].
Yes you're right. V x B = (V_y * B)xhat - (V_x * B)yhat + (0)zhat
So the x component is B*ydot, and y component is -B*xdot
 

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