Lorentz transformation on mode functions

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the transformation of mode functions of a scalar field under Lorentz transformations, specifically how these functions are expressed in different inertial frames. It involves theoretical considerations of the Klein-Gordon equation's invariance and the implications for scalar fields and their mode functions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the mode function ##\phi(x^\mu;\omega,\mathbf k)## can be transformed to ##\phi(x'^\mu;\omega',\mathbf k')## using the Lorentz transformation, assuming the Klein-Gordon equation is Lorentz invariant.
  • Another participant agrees that it is legitimate to Lorentz transform the coordinates but questions whether the transformed functions retain their status as mode functions, depending on their specific form.
  • Some participants argue that while the functional form of mode functions may appear similar across frames, they cannot be directly transformed into each other under Lorentz transformations, citing examples like ##\sin(\omega t)##.
  • There is a discussion about whether the Lorentz transformation of a mode function in frame ##S## results in a mode function in frame ##S'##, with some suggesting it may depend on the nature of the functions involved.
  • A later reply requests clarification on the definition of the mode functions in question, indicating that without this, the discussion cannot reach a resolution.
  • One participant references a paper discussing Bessel functions as mode functions and describes how the authors suggest transforming these functions under Lorentz transformations, noting that the normalization constant may also change.
  • Another participant seeks clarification on what is meant by "mode functions," indicating a potential misunderstanding of the term in the context of the discussion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the transformation of mode functions under Lorentz transformations preserves their form as mode functions. There is no consensus on the implications of these transformations, and the discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific definitions and properties of the mode functions involved.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the need for a clear definition of mode functions to properly address the transformation question. The discussion also reflects uncertainty about the relationship between the forms of mode functions in different frames and the conditions under which they can be considered equivalent.

Haorong Wu
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TL;DR
How to do a Lorentz transformation on mode functions?
Suppose we can boost from a frame ##S## to another frame ##S'## by using a Lorentz transformation ##\Lambda##. Also, ##\phi(x^\mu;\omega,\mathbf k)## is a mode function of a scalar field in frame ##S##. Then, how do we express this mode function in frame ##S'##? Here is my attempt.

First, the Klein-Gordon equation is Lorentz invariant, so we can use ##x^\mu=\Lambda^{~~\mu}_\nu x'^\nu## to change the coordinates in ##\phi(x^\mu;\omega,\mathbf k)##.

Second, the four wave vector is also transformed by ##k^\mu=\Lambda^{~~\mu}_\nu k'^\nu##.

In total, I simply transform the coordinates and four wave vector in the mode function ##\phi(x^\mu;\omega,\mathbf k)## to ##\phi(x'^\mu;\omega',\mathbf k')##. Is this correct?

Thanks ahead.
 
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I'm not too familiar with this, so please forgive the partial answer.

First, if you have a scalar function ##\phi(x^a)## on spacetime, obviously it's legitimate to Lorntz transform the coordinates and write ##\phi(x'^a)##. Physically, we're saying that the scalar field has the same value at some event ##E## whether you give ##E## the coordinates ##x^a## or ##x'^a##.

Second, I think mode functions are a specific set of functions. From symmetry, they presumably have the same functional form in any inertial frame. So if the mode functions defined in frame ##S## were the infinite set of functions ##\sin(\omega t)## (a set parameterised by ##\omega##) then the mode functions defined in frame ##S'## would be ##\sin(\omega t')## (again, ##\omega## is merely a parameter so I'm not worrying about primes).

Assuming that's correct, the answer to your question depends on the form of the mode functions. I think they are themselves scalar fields, so it's obviously legitimate to just transform their coordinate dependence and you get the scalar field expressed in some other coordinates. But is that field a mode function in the other coordinates? If the mode functions are something like ##\sin(\omega t)## then the answer is no - the transformed version of this field will have a spatial dependence so can't be written ##\sin(\omega t')##. If, on the other hand, they're something like ##\sin(k_ax^a)## and any ##k^a## is allowed then yes since ##k_ax^a## is a scalar itself. But if there's some restriction on the ##k^a## you're allowed to use it depends if the allowed vectors in ##S## and ##S'## map onto each other.
 
Ibix said:
From symmetry, they presumably have the same functional form in any inertial frame.
No, they can't. For example, suppose we have a function ##\sin \omega t## in one frame. A Lorentz transformation will obviously make this ##\sin \omega \gamma \left( t' - v x' \right)## in a different frame.
 
PeterDonis said:
No, they can't. For example, suppose we have a function ##\sin \omega t## in one frame. A Lorentz transformation will obviously make this ##\sin \omega \gamma \left( t' - v x' \right)## in a different frame.
Sure, but I get the impression that the mode functions are the basis of a decomposition (possibly just a Fourier decomposition) of the scalar function. So if I pick frame ##S## and get a decomposition in terms of a weighted sum (or integral) of a one-parameter family of functions (e.g. ##\sin(\omega t)##) then if I follow the same process in ##S'## I'll get a decomposition in terms of a weighted sum/integral of ##\sin(\omega t')##. That's the symmetry I was meaning, and those hypothetical mode functions are not related by a Lorentz transform, as you note.

So the answer to the OP's question depends on whether the Lorentz transform of an ##S## mode function is an ##S'## mode function. That could be the case if mode functions look like (e.g.) ##\sin(k_ax^a)##, but need not be. With the limited information I have about how a mode function is defined, I don't know.
 
Last edited:
Ibix said:
the mode functions are the basis of a decomposition (possibly just a Fourier decomposition) of the scalar function.
Yes, they are, but they're still functions, and their arguments still have to transform the way I described.

Ibix said:
if I pick frame ##S## and get a decomposition in terms of a weighted sum (or integral) of a one-parameter family of functions (e.g. ##\sin(\omega t)##) then if I follow the same process in ##S'## I'll get a decomposition in terms of a weighted sum/integral of ##\sin(\omega t')##.
Ah, I see. Yes, you can do the same process in both frames, but the functions you end up won't be Lorentz transforms of each other, as you note.

Ibix said:
the answer to the OP's question depends on whether the Lorentz transform of an ##S## mode function is an ##S'## mode function. That could be the case if mode functions look like (e.g.) ##\sin(k_ax^a)##, but need not be.
I think we need a reference from the OP to resolve this.
 
Haorong Wu said:
Is this correct?
Can you give a reference for how the mode functions you are asking about are defined? Without that we can't answer your question since we don't know what the mode functions are functions of.
 
Hi, @Ibix, and @PeterDonis. I am recently interested in boosting a scalar field, so I found this paper, Relativistic Hall Effect. I am sorry it is not open-access, so I am not sure whether you can access it or not.

The mode functions, Eq. (9), are a little complicated as the authors use the Bessel functions. Around Eq. (10), the authors argue that
Since the Klein-Gordon equation is Lorentz-invariant, one can find the form of the Bessel beam in the moving reference frame by substituting the Lorentz transformation into Eq. (9). Then, the scalar wave function in the moving frame becomes ##\psi'(\mathbf r',t')=\psi[\mathbf r(\mathbf r',t'),t(\mathbf r',t')] ##.

The authors do not say anything about the wave four-vector.

As you have discussed, the mode functions of a scalar field should give the same value at the same point irrespective of how the coordinates are defined. For simplicity, let us consider the plane wave solutions, ##\psi(x^\mu)=C\exp (ik_\mu x^\mu)##, in frame ##S##, and a boost ##\Lambda^{\mu'}_{~~\nu}## to another frame ##S'##. The coordinates are transformed as ##x^{\mu'}=\Lambda^{\mu'}_{~~\nu} x^\nu##, and the mode functions are transformed into ##\psi'(x^{\mu'})##. Since ##\psi'(x^{\mu'})=\psi(x^\mu)##, we should transform the wave four-vector at the same time---i.e., ##k_{\mu'}=\Lambda_{\mu'}^{~~\nu}k_\nu##, such that ##\exp (ik_\mu x^\mu) \rightarrow \exp (ik_{\mu'} x^{\mu'})=\exp (ik_{\mu} x^\mu)##. The normalization constant ##C## is proportional to ##k^{-1/2}_0##, so it should be altered, as well.

I think the above transformation of the mode functions does not depend on the explicit form of the functions, though after substituting the new coordinates and wave four-vector, the form may be altered.
 
So, by "mode functions" you mean the modes of a transmission line? If not, please say what you do mean.
 

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