Magnetic field/simple current loop

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the magnetic field generated by a current loop that is tilted and centered at the origin, specifically examining the field's behavior in the xy-plane. Participants explore the relationship between the magnetic field strength and the distance from points along the loop, as well as the methods for calculating the total magnetic field from the contributions of individual segments of the loop.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that the strength of the magnetic field at any point in the xy-plane is proportional to the difference of the inverse square distances from the points where the current enters and exits the loop.
  • Another participant questions whether the contribution of each segment of the current can be calculated separately by determining a vector perpendicular to the line connecting the point of interest and the current segment, with a magnitude based on the inverse square of the distance.
  • A different participant asserts that for a closed loop, the magnetic field does not follow an inverse square law.
  • One participant suggests that calculating the magnetic field of a finite loop requires the use of elliptic functions, indicating the complexity of the problem.
  • Another participant introduces the concept that the magnetic field can be related to the solid angle subtended by the current loop at the observation point.
  • There is a discussion regarding the magnetic scalar potential (MSP) and its relationship to the solid angle, with one participant noting that the MSP can be computed using elliptic integrals or Legendre polynomials.
  • Participants discuss the nature of the MSP, questioning whether it is discontinuous or multi-valued, with clarification that it can be single-valued in free space without currents.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between the magnetic field and distance, with some contesting the inverse square law for closed loops. The discussion includes multiple competing models and approaches for calculating the magnetic field, indicating that consensus has not been reached.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of calculating the magnetic field for a finite loop and the potential need for advanced mathematical tools like elliptic functions. There are also references to the scalar potential and its properties, which may depend on specific conditions or definitions.

granpa
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given a current loop, centered at the origin, and tilted 90 degrees so that it enters at x=1 and exits at x=-1, carrying a unit amount of current, and completely disregarding the z axis.

is the strength of the magnetic field at any point in the xy plane proportional to 1/(distance from 1,0)^2 - 1/(distance from -1,0)^2

in other words does it have an inverse square relation to the current passing through those two points.

I know there are better ways to calculate the net field but I'm looking to understand what is happening here at an intuitive level.

I need the whole field. not just the far field or some sort of approximation.
 
Last edited:
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what I mean is:

can I find the contribution of each of the 2 currents separately by simply finding the vector which is at a right angle to the vector from that point to the current and making its magnitude equal to 1/(distance to the current)^2

and is adding those 2 vectors all that i need to do to calculate the total field
 
If it is a closed loop, B does not go like 1/r^2.
 
ok. so evidently thet won't work.

thinking 3 dimensionally, if we look at only one of the 2 currents (due to current along line element dL) then we can see from the symmetry that its field is confined to a wedge extending from the origin through the endpoints of that line element.

I have no idea how to go about calculating the resulting field. I've never seen or done anything like it.
 
To find the magnetic field of a finite loop, you will need to use elliptic functions. It's complicated.

However, it can be proven in general that

\vec B(\vec r) \propto \nabla \Omega(\vec r)

where \Omega(\vec r) is the (oriented) solid angle subtended by the current loop at the observation point.
 
any connection to the scalar potential of a magnetic field?
 
granpa said:
any connection to the scalar potential of a magnetic field?
Yes, Omega is the magnetic scalar potential, which happens to equal the solid angle subtended by a current loop of any shape.
For a circular current loop, the MSP can be found be either an elliptic integral, or by a Legendre polynomial, partial wave expansion.
 
so the msp isn't so much discontinuous as multi-valued (like an angle)?
 
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  • #10
It's multivalued, or discontinuous if you make a branch cut.

However, in free space (in the absence of any currents), it is single-valued, as in this case (there is no J at the observation point).
 

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