Measuring speed of light with enhanced detectors

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the measurement of the speed of light, particularly in relation to the use of telescopes in experimental setups. Participants explore the implications of the inverse squared law and its perceived effects on speed and observation of distant objects, including vehicles. The conversation touches on concepts from relativity and optical effects.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the inverse squared law affects the perception of speed and length of distant objects, such as vehicles.
  • Others argue that the inverse squared law does not have any effect on speed, questioning the relevance of this law to the discussion.
  • A participant expresses confusion over the various inverse square laws and their applicability to the discussion.
  • There is a suggestion that telescopes are commonly used in measuring the speed of light, but the relevance of this to the previous statements is questioned.
  • One participant describes personal observations of distant vehicles appearing shorter and moving slower, suggesting a possible optical illusion.
  • Another participant clarifies that the effects being described relate to optical effects and perspective rather than relativistic effects.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the connection between the observations of distant objects and the principles of relativity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the relationship between the inverse squared law and speed perception. There are competing views on the relevance of optical effects versus relativistic effects, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the understanding of which specific inverse square laws are being referenced, and the discussion includes assumptions about the nature of observations and their interpretations. The relationship between optical effects and relativistic effects is also not fully clarified.

Darko M
Messages
11
Reaction score
0
Only but few may disagree that the inverse squared law affects speed. For example, not only lengths of far away vehicles shorten, (with increase in distances from obsevation) the moving vehicles generally seem to have "slowed" down; the direction either from right to left or vise versa.
Please has anybody tried measuring speed of light, having inco-operated say, a telescope into the measuring apparatus?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Darko M said:
Only but few may disagree that the inverse squared law affects speed.
I must be one of the few because I disagree that the inverse squared law has any effect on speed. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you are referencing but I don't see how the two are related in any way.

Darko M said:
For example, not only lengths of far away vehicles shorten, (with increase in distances from obsevation) the moving vehicles generally seem to have "slowed" down; the direction either from right to left or vise versa.
Oh, that's what you are talking about. But this has nothing to do with anything actually slowing down or actually being shortened. Did you think that this is what relativity is about?

Darko M said:
Please has anybody tried measuring speed of light, having inco-operated say, a telescope into the measuring apparatus?

Yes, a telescope is often incorporated into a measuring apparatus designed to determine the speed of light, but what has that got to do with your previous statements?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: 1 person
I really don't understand what you are saying. I can't say I am one of the "few" that disagree that "the inverse squared law affects speed" because I don't know what you mean! There are a large number of "inverse square laws" (gravity, light intensity, etc.). Which one are you referring to? Distant vehicles seem to have slowed down? That is certainly not my experience? And I don't know what you mean by "incorporating a telescope into the measuring apparatus". EVERY experiment measuring the speed of light that I know of uses a telescope because of the large distances required to reasonably measure a time span for the motion at the speed of light. But, as far as I know, no experiment has shown that the speed of light varies with distance from the earth.

(I'm wondering if you are thinking that a telescope "sees" light many light years away? We can see what is many light years away but the light we are seeing is light in the telescope.)

Again, I need to type faster!
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: 1 person
I think the OP is confusing linear and angular speed.
 
Big thanks to you all, folks. Well I never knew telescopes were used. I was then only thinking that a very powerful telescope may vary the result of measuring the speed of light.
But as regards distant objects say buses, mine own eyes have always confirmed this observation to me.
It is like this: Assume you stand facing a road that "stretches" away horizontally from left to/through right. And then there is a considerable perpendicular distance of separation (of you) from this road. Now from what I have always observed, long buses seemed to have become shorter than usual; and their observed speeds seemed decreased compared to their actual speeds. That's it. I have always noticed this phenomenon. Maybe my lenses just have their own way of creating this mirage of a sort; I probably may have to see an optician(?) soon.
 
Darko M said:
Big thanks to you all, folks. Well I never knew telescopes were used. I was then only thinking that a very powerful telescope may vary the result of measuring the speed of light.
But as regards distant objects say buses, mine own eyes have always confirmed this observation to me.
It is like this: Assume you stand facing a road that "stretches" away horizontally from left to/through right. And then there is a considerable perpendicular distance of separation (of you) from this road. Now from what I have always observed, long buses seemed to have become shorter than usual; and their observed speeds seemed decreased compared to their actual speeds. That's it. I have always noticed this phenomenon. Maybe my lenses just have their own way of creating this mirage of a sort; I probably may have to see an optician(?) soon.
Again, my question: Did you think that this is what relativity is about?
 
Darko M said:
Big thanks to you all, folks. Well I never knew telescopes were used. I was then only thinking that a very powerful telescope may vary the result of measuring the speed of light.
But as regards distant objects say buses, mine own eyes have always confirmed this observation to me.
It is like this: Assume you stand facing a road that "stretches" away horizontally from left to/through right. And then there is a considerable perpendicular distance of separation (of you) from this road. Now from what I have always observed, long buses seemed to have become shorter than usual; and their observed speeds seemed decreased compared to their actual speeds. That's it. I have always noticed this phenomenon. Maybe my lenses just have their own way of creating this mirage of a sort; I probably may have to see an optician(?) soon.
None of this is relevant for relativity. Relativistic effects are what remain after accounting for all optical effects.
 
ghwellsjr said:
Again, my question: Did you think that this is what relativity is about?

Certainly not.
 
DaleSpam said:
None of this is relevant for relativity. Relativistic effects are what remain after accounting for all optical effects.

Parden my ignorance, but have you ever experienced an observation of a sort?
 
  • #10
Darko M said:
ghwellsjr said:
Again, my question: Did you think that this is what relativity is about?
Certainly not.
Then why are you asking it on the relativity forum?
 
  • #11
Darko M said:
Big thanks to you all, folks. Well I never knew telescopes were used. I was then only thinking that a very powerful telescope may vary the result of measuring the speed of light.
But as regards distant objects say buses, mine own eyes have always confirmed this observation to me.
It is like this: Assume you stand facing a road that "stretches" away horizontally from left to/through right. And then there is a considerable perpendicular distance of separation (of you) from this road. Now from what I have always observed, long buses seemed to have become shorter than usual; and their observed speeds seemed decreased compared to their actual speeds. That's it. I have always noticed this phenomenon. Maybe my lenses just have their own way of creating this mirage of a sort; I probably may have to see an optician(?) soon.
Right, so what you are talking about is the optical effects of angular distance measurement, aka "perspective": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perspective_(visual )
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #12
Darko M said:
Parden my ignorance, but have you ever experienced an observation of a sort?
Of course.
 

Similar threads

High School One-Way Speed of Light
  • · Replies 93 ·
4
Replies
93
Views
6K
Undergrad Standing light waves if the one-way speed of light were not constant?
  • · Replies 36 ·
2
Replies
36
Views
3K
Undergrad Why is Rømer's light speed measurement not one-way?
  • · Replies 42 ·
2
Replies
42
Views
3K
High School Measuring the speed of light on moving systems
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
Undergrad Has anyone measured the speed of light in one direction?
  • · Replies 45 ·
2
Replies
45
Views
7K
High School Measuring Speed of Light: Transit Time & Interference
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
3K
Graduate 1-Way Speed of Light
  • · Replies 42 ·
2
Replies
42
Views
3K
Undergrad Is the concept of a one-way speed of light meaningful and measurable?
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
5K
Undergrad How to Measure Speed of Light & Is It Constant?
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
Undergrad Can we determine the one way speed of light by combined measurements?
  • · Replies 146 ·
5
Replies
146
Views
11K