Meteor Entering Orbit of a Sun (cons. energy & momentum) [very hard algebra]

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SUMMARY

The discussion revolves around solving a physics problem involving a meteor's trajectory influenced by the Sun's gravitational force. The key equations utilized include conservation of momentum and energy, specifically: initial energy as 1/2mv0^2 and final energy as 1/2mV^2 - GMm/b. The participant struggled with algebraic manipulation to isolate the distance b of the meteor at its closest approach, ultimately realizing an error in the quadratic formula application. The correct formulation leads to the solution for b, confirming the importance of careful algebraic handling in physics problems.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of gravitational forces and motion
  • Familiarity with conservation of momentum and energy principles
  • Proficiency in algebra, particularly quadratic equations
  • Knowledge of gravitational constant (G) and its application in physics
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  • Study the derivation of gravitational force equations in classical mechanics
  • Learn advanced algebra techniques for solving quadratic equations
  • Explore the implications of conservation laws in orbital mechanics
  • Investigate the role of initial conditions in trajectory calculations
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DD31
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Homework Statement


Alright, so I've given this guy a few cracks, and I think I'm close to it, but apparently I'm not right, so here's how it goes. Simple in concept.

A meteor moves toward the solar system with speed v0 in a direction such that it would miss the sun by a distance d if it were not attracted by the sun's gravitational force. Denote the mass of the sun by M. Find the distance b of the meteor from the sun at the point of closest approach in terms of v0, d, and M (and G, the gravitational constant).

http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/8376/lg0704figgx8.jpg
http://g.imageshack.us/img515/lg0704figgx8.jpg/1/


Homework Equations


They effectively give me a few formulas in the helper questions provided:

The momentum and energy are conserved
Initial energy = 1/2mv0^2
Final energy = 1/2mV^2 - GMm/b

Initial Momentum = mv0d
Final Momentum = mVb

Where V=the final velocity of the object at point b

The Attempt at a Solution



I feel like the error here is most likely in my algebra, as I'm having a ton of troble easily isolating b. But here are the ways I've tried so far:

I always start with the equations:

1/2mv0^2 = 1/2mV^2 - GMm/b

and

mv0d = mVb.

I then cancel out all the m's and multiply out the 2 in the top one to get:

v0^2 = V^2 - 2GM/b

and

v0d = Vb

From this point, I'll either solve for b in the top or solve for V in the bottom. If I solve for b in the top, I get:

V^2 - v0^2 = 2GM/b, b = 2GM/(V^2 - v0^2)

Then I would solve for V in the bottom one:

V = v0d/b

Subbing that in gets

b = 2GM/((v0d/b)^2 - v0^2)

And this is where I think I go wrong...trying to get b out of this. I've tried rearranging the equation to bring all the b's to one side, I've tried resubstituting stuff...most recently I tried quad formula:

I factored out the v0's on the bottom:

2GM/((v0^2)(d^2/b^2-1)) = b

b(d^2/b^2 - 1) = 2GM/v0^2

d^2/b - b = 2GM/v0^2

d^2 - b^2 = 2GMb/v0^2

b^2 + 2GMb/(v0^2) - d^2 = 0

then, using 1 as (a), 2GM/v0^2 as (b) and -d^2 as (c), I did quad form and got:

(-2GM/(v0^2)+sqrt((2GM/v0^2)^2-4d^2))/2

or

http://img395.imageshack.us/img395/482/e5a7daf972eacf000cabb54ld4.gif
http://g.imageshack.us/img395/e5a7daf972eacf000cabb54ld4.gif/1/


But that was not correct


I'm officially stumped by this point...I've taken 4 cracks at it, to no avail. Am I setting up the formulas incorrectly, or am I just screwing up on the algebra over and over?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
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You are really close.

What is "-4ac", when c is -d2? (And a=1 of course)
 
haha...wow. I see it...it just should be + 4d^2. Just put that in and it worked. Thanks a ton...Almost sure I wouldn't have picked that out without doing the whole thing over again.

Thanks.
 

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