Monotonic increasing or monotonic decreasing

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around determining whether the sequence {an} = n + (1/n) is monotonic increasing or monotonic decreasing. Participants are exploring the properties of sequences in the context of calculus.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss evaluating the sequence by calculating specific terms and comparing them. There are attempts to derive a general condition for monotonicity by analyzing the difference an+1 - an. Questions arise about the appropriate value of M and how to establish the inequality for all n.

Discussion Status

The conversation is active, with participants providing guidance on how to approach the problem. Some participants express confusion about the algebra involved, while others clarify steps and encourage further exploration of the inequalities. There is no explicit consensus, but a productive direction is evident as participants work through the algebraic expressions.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating through algebraic manipulations and inequalities, with some expressing uncertainty about their calculations. The discussion reflects a learning process where assumptions and definitions are being questioned.

Ki-nana18
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Homework Statement


1. Determine whether the sequence {an} = n+(1/n) is monotonic increasing or monotonic decreasing.


Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


I plugged in some digits and got this
a1=2
a2=5/2=2.5
a3=10/3=3.3333333
a4=17/4=4.25
a5=26/5=5.2
I drew the coclusion that it is monotonic increasing. Is that right?
 
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You need to show that an+1 >= an for all n >= some number M. You can't just use the values of a few elements of the sequence.
 


Mark44 said:
n >= some number M

What is M? How do I find it?
 


Try calculating an+1 - an
 


Ki-nana18 said:
What is M? How do I find it?
You get to say what it is.
 


n+1+(1/n+1)>= n+(1/n) @n=3
4.25>3.33333

Since an+1 is greater that an the sequence is monotonic increasing.:confused:
 


No, that won't do. It's true that n + 1 is always > n (assuming n >0), but 1/(n + 1) < 1/n. If each expression on the left side was larger that the corresponding expression on the right side, then I would buy it.

How do you know that for n = 37, or 503, or whatever, that n + 1 + 1/(n + 1) isn't less than n + 1/n?
 


Thank you for all your help. But I am completely lost. But I'll try one more question. Do I solve an+1>= an, for n?
 
  • #10


Ok, so tons of algebra. Thank you for all your help. :smile:
 
  • #11


It's hardly "tons of algebra." Unless you think three of so lines constitutes "tons."

Presumably you're in a calculus class if you're asking questions about sequences, so it's reasonble to assume that you have mastered algebra to some extent.
 
  • #12


Is this right:
n+1+1/(n+1)≥n+(1/n)
(n+1)^2/(n+1)≥((n^2+1))/n
n(n+1)≥ ((n^2+1))/n (n)
n^2+n≥n^2+1
n≥1
 
  • #13


Ki-nana18 said:
Is this right:
n+1+1/(n+1)≥n+(1/n)
(n+1)^2/(n+1)≥((n^2+1))/n
There's a mistake in the line above, on the left side.
Ki-nana18 said:
n(n+1)≥ ((n^2+1))/n (n)
How does the line above follow from the line above it?
Ki-nana18 said:
n^2+n≥n^2+1
n≥1

Another way you can do this is to show that n + 1 + 1/(n + 1) - (n + 1/n) ≥ 0 for all n ≥ M, where you specify what M is.
 
  • #14


Ok I did an+1-an>=0 and I got (n2+3n+1)/(n(n+1))>=0. I'm not sure what to do now. I can't cancel any "n" out b/c its all addition. What do I do now?
 
  • #15


n + 1 + 1/(n + 1) - n - 1/n
= 1 + 1/(n + 1) - 1/n
= ?

Leave the first 1 as-is.
 
  • #16


So it equals (2n+1)/(n2+n)>=-1?
 
  • #17


***Leave the first 1 as-is.***

Just rewrite 1 + 1/(n + 1) - 1/n as an expression it is equal to. I don't want to see any inequality sign yet.
 
  • #18


(n^2+3n+1)/(n(n+1))?
 
  • #19


DON'T DO ANYTHING WITH THE FIRST 1!

1 + 1/(n + 1) - 1/n = 1 + ?
 
  • #20


1+(1/(n(n+1))? sorry. :cry:
 
  • #21


You have an incorrect sign. Can you find it? There are only two showing.
 
  • #22


1-(1/(n(n+1)))?
 
  • #23


YES!

So here is where we are.
an + 1 - an
= n + 1 + 1/(n + 1) - [n + 1/n]
= 1 + 1/(n+1) - 1/n
= 1 - 1/(n(n + 1))

1/(n(n+1) is at most 1/2, when n = 1. For all other value of n, 1/(n(n + 1)) < 1/2. This is pretty obvious, so probably doesn't need to be proved.

So we're subtracting a positive number that is at most 1/2 from 1. What does that say about the sign of 1 - 1/(n(n + 1))? What does that say about the sign of an + 1 - an? What does that say about the sequence?
 
  • #24


What does that say about the sign of 1 - 1/(n(n + 1))?
The sign would be positive.
What does that say about the sign of an + 1 - an?
The sign would be positive.
What does that say about the sequence?
This sequence is monotonic increasing.
 
  • #25


Good. I especially liked it that you were assertive, and didn't add question marks.
 
  • #26


Thank you so much for all your help! I do have a tendency of second guessing myself when it comes to math. I will be eternally grateful to you. :smile:
 

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