My friends suck or I am too whiny?

[moe darklight]

Some of you seems to view me as a freak. A disease that needs to be eliminated by going to see professional help. Yes, I do understand the importance of seeking professional help but I don't like the way you guys are pushing it. Is like I am an unbearable social disease or something, that needs to be eradicated from the society asap.

There's a difference between being a disease and having one. don't start acting the offended victim; you wanted our honest opinion, and I'm giving you my honest opinion: I think you have problems that can't be fixed by simple advise.

If you were to come to this forum complaining that your legs don't work and you have no clue why, I'd tell you to go see a doctor.

being new to a country can be tough. as a kid I moved around all the time. I speak three languages, all of them with an accent. everywhere I go I sound like an immigrant. even within countries my parents could never settle for one city, up until 2003, I've never lived in the same place or gone to the same school for more than two years.

that can do a number on you too, and I did go through a period when I was heavily bullied when I got here. my first year of high school I was about as big a loser as you can be. but I've climbed my way out of that hole, and now the same kids that used to make fun of me in grade 9 and 10 are the ones calling me to hang out over the weekend.

the difference is that I could tell that I was a doormat. most people who are can. the fact that you couldn't even tell, that you consider people who pretend not to know you in public your friends, that, along with some of your comments and questions, tells me that you might have bigger issues than simple social awkwardness, and that it can't hurt you to get that checked.

 

[CaptainQuasar]

that can do a number on you too, and I did go through a period when I was heavily bullied when I got here. my first year of high school I was about as big a loser as you can be. but I've climbed my way out of that hole, and now the same kids that used to make fun of me in grade 9 and 10 are the ones calling me to hang out over the weekend.

I don't think you were a loser moe, it sounds like you were a normal kid. I don't think johndude is a loser either. But btw becoming friends with the bullies doesn't make one not a loser, that's just as likely to make someone a loser.

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[_Mayday_]

(I want join military but I want do that only so that I feel more attractive to girls and relieve my stress by poping a few rounds into someone.. both are very bad reasons)

Erm...there is more to life than popping rounds into people. Dude, get some self respect. Find people who like you for who you are and not because you do their homework. Do you have any interests other than your studies?

Don't do other peoples homework! People who don't work deserve to fail and drop out, leave them to it, I don't want a lazy bum who hasn't done any work to get my job!

 

[Evo]

But btw becoming friends with the bullies doesn't make one not a loser, that's just as likely to make someone a loser

He wasn't saying that he sought out their friendship, but that they now seek out his friendship.

 

[CaptainQuasar]

He wasn't saying that he sought out their friendship, but that they now seek out his friendship.

Good point. But I can imagine ways of getting bullies to seek out your friendship that are still totally compatible with being a loser. Being socially connected or sought-after no more signifies that someone has real friendships than people seeking out homework help from you does. Elvis, for example, had lots of people seeking out his friendship but I would say that he was pretty messed up socially.

But as I said I think that neither moe in high school (or now!) or johndude qualify as losers.

I think johndude should pursue substance in his life, not simply popularity or a salve for his loneliness. That substance does involve avoiding whiny victimhood, as you and moe rightly point out, but I think that moe is oversimplifying things.

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[Huckleberry]

No, I havn't seen the counselor yet. I am planning to do that on wednesday and see what results I get.

I think you have chosen the best course of action with this decision. This forum isn't intended to offer professional psychiatric diagnosis and advice to individuals seeking help. Your counselor can hopefully offer you advice better suited to your needs, and is in a better position than anyone here to determine what, if any, professional help may be beneficial to you.

Ok, so apparently I don't have personality. That's probably true cause I don't even know what personality is. Yeah I don't know human to human interaction too well either cause well you know, I had relatively few close human contact in my life. Mostly interacted with my family. When I first came here, I didn't speak English nor know the social norms. The outside world was very hostile to me. (I get teased and made fun of all of the time in elementary school, when I first came. Got better in middle school and gone by high school) Hey I wish there was a textbook so I can read up on it.

Understanding of a thing is not necessary for a thing to exist. You do have a personality, and I admire many of the virtues that you exhibit in the few paragraphs that you've posted in these forums. You are trusting, considerate, honest, and most importantly, humble. I'm sure you have many other excellent qualities. I think all you need is a place to meet people who appreciate you for who you are, and not what functions you excel at. From what I can see you would be an ideal friend.
(I notice you use the present tense in the first sentence in your parenthesis, but past tense in the second. As you remember the experience of being teased does it feel to you as if it were in the present?)

I dunno, I thought myself as pretty independent. Most people at my age - first year university-are living in residence. They can't fathom the thought of living by themselves. I live by myself and financially independent. (Only money I get is from loan and bursuaries and that pay for my tutiton, food and rent) I dunno, I guess I stay in isolation alot. Sometimes that becomes too unbearable and that might be why I sometimes don't mind being a "doormat". I rather have human interactions than stay in complete isolation.

Don't waste your excellent qualities by appealing to people who don't deserve or respect them. I know that negative attention is preferable to none at all, but it is at least as harmful. With consistent negative reinforcement your self-image will suffer more. Avoid participating in that pattern of behaviour. Be creative and courageous and find a way to meet people who will respect you, and offer a positive pattern of behaviour. I think those positive patterns are necessary for learning vital social skills that will help you in all aspects of life. They are as necessary for a healthy mind as food, water and shelter are for a healthy body.

Some of you seems to view me as a freak. A disease that needs to be eliminated by going to see professional help. Yes, I do understand the importance of seeking professional help but I don't like the way you guys are pushing it. Is like I am an unbearable social disease or something, that needs to be eradicated from the society asap.

People often fear what they do not understand. Not every opinion of you is going to be positive, and you shouldn't expect them to be, but the majority of these negative comments directed at you have come from yourself. These are proud lies that don't become you at all. They will only hinder your social development. Knock it off!

Be reasonable in your self-assessment. When you find a way to accept yourself then others will be more inclined to accept you as well. It's a large and imposing step, but it's not as difficult as you might think. I think it's worth it to try.

 

[moe darklight]

[...]

I haven't changed as a person. I just changed my outlook. I have friends of all types, from straight-A university students, to high-school drop-outs who've been in jail, even if I don't agree with their views or lifestyle, I'm still the same nice guy and believe in being nice to everyone. I just learned the difference between being nice and being a pushover.

So no, I didn't just join the gang in a desperate quest for acceptance. I just learned self-respect. And I try to be friends with everyone.

 

[Cyrus]

I don't think you were a loser moe, it sounds like you were a normal kid. I don't think johndude is a loser either. But btw becoming friends with the bullies doesn't make one not a loser, that's just as likely to make someone a loser.

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Explain what was normal about his situation Captain...

But, who the hell cares about 'bullies'. Are we in high school still? Get real.

 

[CaptainQuasar]

Explain what was normal about his situation Captain...

Feeling distant from other people and a little depressed because of it and harried by the challenges of life is perfectly normal. Explain what's so abnormal about this situation.

But, who the hell cares about 'bullies'. Are we in high school still? Get real.

I guess maybe you haven't run into it but there are bullies everywhere, not just school. People in all stages and walks of life love pushing others around to gratify their egos and feel powerful. Bosses or colleagues who aren't satisfied with you acting professionally and responsibly, they try to use their leverage to make you to kiss their feet and hang on their every word… girls or guys you're in a relationship with who like being able to push your buttons and manipulate you… you can run into a bully anywhere.

But anyways, it was moe who brought up being bullied in school. Tell your “get real” to him.

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[Moonbear]

Feeling distant from other people and a little depressed because of it and harried by the challenges of life is perfectly normal. Explain what's so abnormal about this situation.

Um, no, that's not normal. This is why we're suggesting counseling. If it was normal, he wouldn't be feeling so crappy about it. It shouldn't be so hard to figure out how to make a friend or two by the time you're an adult, and a lot of what he's posted here suggests it's not just some simple explanation like moving around a lot and not having time to get to know people well enough to be friends yet, but more that he's struggling to figure out how interpersonal relationships work at all. It's really not doing him a favor to tell him this is perfectly normal when it isn't, because that won't make the problem go away. Accepting that this IS a problem of some sort is the first thing he needs to do to remedy it. Whether it's something that can be addressed through simple counseling, or whether this is an underlying disorder that is making it harder for him to develop normal social interactions (i.e., an anxiety disorder or clinical depression), is what a professional can assess in person and help him with.

 

[CaptainQuasar]

Um, no, that's not normal. This is why we're suggesting counseling. If it was normal, he wouldn't be feeling so crappy about it. It shouldn't be so hard to figure out how to make a friend or two by the time you're an adult, and a lot of what he's posted here suggests it's not just some simple explanation like moving around a lot and not having time to get to know people well enough to be friends yet, but more that he's struggling to figure out how interpersonal relationships work at all. It's really not doing him a favor to tell him this is perfectly normal when it isn't, because that won't make the problem go away. Accepting that this IS a problem of some sort is the first thing he needs to do to remedy it. Whether it's something that can be addressed through simple counseling, or whether this is an underlying disorder that is making it harder for him to develop normal social interactions (i.e., an anxiety disorder or clinical depression), is what a professional can assess in person and help him with.

I guess maybe our experiences have just been different. I've know lots of people who have been depressed and I knew lots of people in college who had only made the most superficial friends - like johndude's library friends - before they got to college. And it sounds like he got to college relatively recently - heck, half the reason that colleges even have counselors is because college freshmen and other college students get to feeling lonely and depressed away from home.

When I'm saying that his experiences are normal I'm not saying that he shouldn't go see a counselor or a therapist. Look back in the thread, I've been urging him to see a counselor too, unlike the “You're a sucker. Sorry.” type comments that the thread started off with.

What I'm saying is that johndude is not a “freak”, as he says, for being the type of person who gets picked on, for feeling depressed or going to see a counselor. Half the effing people in the country are either depressed or seeing a therapist or should be.

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[CaptainQuasar]

And by the way -

Accepting that this IS a problem of some sort is the first thing he needs to do to remedy it.

Weren't you the one saying earlier that people shouldn't try to diagnose him online? I don't think that you should be telling him that he definitely has some sort of mental problem.

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[Moonbear]

Weren't you the one saying earlier that people shouldn't try to diagnose him online? I don't think that you should be telling him that he definitely has some sort of mental problem.

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I'm not diagnosing him, I'm telling him something is wrong...I don't know what is wrong, and it may not be a mental disorder at all...read more carefully what I've written...I've just said that it's not normal. He needs to seek professional help to find out what's going on and how to fix it. I'm really not going to pry into more details about his personal life to find out if there's a non-medical explanation for his difficulties, and there very well may be. But regardless, he needs to talk to someone who knows how to deal with these sorts of problems and get him through it, not just get reassured by a bunch of strangers online that everything is honky dorey when he already knows it isn't.

And, no, "lots" of people aren't depressed constantly for long periods of time. People go through brief periods of disappointment or sadness over things like breakups, but when you don't bounce back, that's when it's a problem. The term "depressed" is seriously overused by kids today; they're always saying they're depressed over this that and the other thing, but no, they aren't, they're just a bit sad or disappointed or frustrated, and the normal reaction is to get over it and move on quickly. When it doesn't go away, it's NOT normal, regardless of whether it's the primary problem (i.e., clinical depression) or a symptom of some other problem (i.e., social awkwardness that interferes with developing meaningful interpersonal relationships...not necessarily even friendships). Also, keep in mind that the OP has shared his age and is NOT in high school anymore. This isn't a little peri-pubertal moodiness. If he was saying he was 15 and school sucks and life sucks and his parents are stupid and his friends are jerks, I'd be saying, yep, that's being 15 and you'll grow out of it.

We could just keep sitting here and saying, oh, yeah, it's fine and normal, and you just need to pull yourself up by the bootstraps and get over it, but I think if he was able to do that on his own, he'd have already done it, don't you? I think he's asking here because he isn't able to do this on his own.

 

[Cyrus]

Feeling distant from other people and a little depressed because of it and harried by the challenges of life is perfectly normal. Explain what's so abnormal about this situation.



I guess maybe you haven't run into it but there are bullies everywhere, not just school. People in all stages and walks of life love pushing others around to gratify their egos and feel powerful. Bosses or colleagues who aren't satisfied with you acting professionally and responsibly, they try to use their leverage to make you to kiss their feet and hang on their every word… girls or guys you're in a relationship with who like being able to push your buttons and manipulate you… you can run into a bully anywhere.

But anyways, it was moe who brought up being bullied in school. Tell your “get real” to him.

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I have not ran into any bullies, at school or not. This is the biggest crock, sorry.

People push around people that are pushovers.

 

[Cyrus]

Feeling distant from other people and a little depressed because of it and harried by the challenges of life is perfectly normal. Explain what's so abnormal about this situation.



I guess maybe you haven't run into it but there are bullies everywhere, not just school. People in all stages and walks of life love pushing others around to gratify their egos and feel powerful. Bosses or colleagues who aren't satisfied with you acting professionally and responsibly, they try to use their leverage to make you to kiss their feet and hang on their every word… girls or guys you're in a relationship with who like being able to push your buttons and manipulate you… you can run into a bully anywhere.

But anyways, it was moe who brought up being bullied in school. Tell your “get real” to him.

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You are way to apologetic to abnormal behavior. Hence, 'get real'. This is so far from normal that I find it disturbing that you would tell him its no big deal.

 

[cristo]

We could just keep sitting here and saying, oh, yeah, it's fine and normal, and you just need to pull yourself up by the bootstraps and get over it, but I think if he was able to do that on his own, he'd have already done it, don't you? I think he's asking here because he isn't able to do this on his own.

Hear, hear. This is about the wisest message I've seen in this thread!

 

[Cyrus]

I hope this is the last thread I have to see in GD about someone who does not know how to talk to other human beings. I really think these threads should just be locked. Were not here to teach you how to open your mouth and talk to people when your an adult, learn it on your own the hard way if you must. Or go google a self help forum, buy a self help book - do something. Just stop pestering us.

 

[moe darklight]

great, now you've gone and made Cyrus angry .

 

[Moonbear]

And, I think with that, we've picked this problem to death. He said he's going to see a counselor, so I expect will get more sound advice there than from the lot of us.