Object moving in the opposite direction of a single force

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter henry3369
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Direction Force
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the dynamics of a hammer (or ball) hanging from a rope in a bus that is accelerating. Participants explore the apparent contradiction of the hammer moving in the opposite direction of the force acting on it, particularly in the context of non-inertial reference frames and the forces at play.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express confusion about why the hammer appears to move left when the bus accelerates to the right, despite only one force being considered.
  • One participant clarifies that the frame of the bus is non-inertial, introducing the concept of inertial forces acting in the opposite direction of the bus's acceleration.
  • Another participant notes that there are two forces acting on the hammer: gravity and the tension in the rope, which together determine the hammer's motion.
  • It is suggested that the hammer hangs at an angle due to the bus's acceleration, with the tension in the rope providing both upward and forward components to balance the forces.
  • One participant emphasizes that the hammer's apparent leftward motion is due to the bus's rightward acceleration, not because of a net force acting on the hammer itself.
  • There is a discussion about how the behavior of the hammer can be observed in different scenarios, such as when the bus accelerates or decelerates.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation of forces acting on the hammer, particularly regarding the role of inertial forces and the net effect of gravity and tension. The discussion remains unresolved as participants explore various perspectives without reaching a consensus.

Contextual Notes

Participants rely on assumptions about the behavior of forces in non-inertial frames and the interactions between tension and gravity, which may not be fully articulated or agreed upon.

henry3369
Messages
194
Reaction score
0
A hammer is hanging by a light rope from the ceiling of a bus. The ceiling of the bus is parallel to the roadway. The bus is traveling in a straight line on a horizontal street. You observe that the hammer hangs at rest with respect to the bus when the angle between the rope and the ceiling of the bus is 67 degrees. What is the acceleration of the bus?

Well I know how to solve this, but I'm confused as to why the ball moves in the opposite direction of the force. Say for example the bus moves right, then the ball goes back slightly. When I break the force into components there is one component pointing upwards and one component to the right. But if there is only 1 force acting on the ball and it is to the right, why is the ball going to the left?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
henry3369 said:
But if there is only 1 force acting on the ball and it is to the right, why is the ball going to the left?
The frame of the bus is non-inertial, so there is an inertial force to the left.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fictitious_force
 
henry3369 said:
Well I know how to solve this, but I'm confused as to why the ball moves in the opposite direction of the force. Say for example the bus moves right, then the ball goes back slightly. When I break the force into components there is one component pointing upwards and one component to the right. But if there is only 1 force acting on the ball and it is to the right, why is the ball going to the left?
Realize that the bus and thus the hammer (ball?) are accelerating. There are two forces acting on the object: gravity and the tension in the rope. If the bus accelerates to the right, then the net force on the object will be to the right. In order for the rope to drag the object along with the bus, it must make an angle with the vertical that is opposite to the direction of the acceleration. The ball accelerates to the right, but hangs to the left of vertical.

You can also view this in terms of inertial forces when viewed from the non-inertial frame of the bus, as A.T. said.
 
But if there is only 1 force acting on the ball and it is to the right, why is the ball going to the left?

The ball is trying to go straight. It just looks like it's going left because the bus is going right.
 
But if there is only 1 force acting on the ball and it is to the right, why is the ball going to the left
There are two forces working on the ball. And the ball isn't going to the left.

The two forces are gravity and the tension from the wire. The (vector) sum of the two forces determines the motion of the ball.

If the bus stands still, the wire is vertical and the tension and the gravity forces are equal and opposite, so the net force on the ball is zero: it hangs still.

If the bus moves with constant velocity (and we wait long enough for a possible swinging to dampen out), again the wire is vertical and the tension and the gravity forces are equal and opposite, so the net force on the ball is zero: it moves with constant velocity.

If the bus accelerates with constant acceleration (and we wait long enough for a possible swinging to dampen out), the ball hangs still for a passenger in the bus. For an observer standing still on the road, the ball accelerates with the same acceleration as the bus. Since the gravity is still pulling straight down, the only force that can bring this acceleration about is the tension in the string. So it has to pull forward while at the same time pulling up to offset the force from gravity.
The wire can only pull in a direction along the wire (try it with a piece of string -- I'm not joking, it's an important insight!) so it hangs as you describe. So the tension forcr from the wire on the ball has an upward component (mg) and a forward component (ma).

If the bus brakes (again with constant deceleration = acceleration in a direction opposite the motion) same story but pulling is now backwards to decelerate the ball.

Try it all out on your next ride with train, car or bicycle with a makeshift pendulum. How it hangs in a left turn, a right turn, etc.

And if you really want to wonder, same thing with a helium ballloon on a string. Won't work for the bicycle case because of the wind spoiling the simplicity.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 49 ·
2
Replies
49
Views
5K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
9K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
5K